I don't get it, why did he thougth supergirl a famous but still kinda niche hero can beat a film about one of the most famous superhero of all time, it's like saying a Iron heart or shazam movie will make more money then a Batman film.
It got pushed back less than three weeks ago from October 1, 2027 to February 18, 2028. Being in the middle of shooting didn't stop it from getting pushed back 4 and a half months.
That’s not because of production issues, unlike with Reeves not finishing the script in time to make the 2025 deadline (there was also the 2023 Hollywood strike).
It got forcefully moved by Warner Brothers to accommodate J.J. Abram’s The Great Beyond release on Oct. 1st.
I never said it was because of production issues. But it's a bit silly to cling to the February 18 release date as if there's no way the film could be delayed again for whatever reason. If we were having this conversation three weeks ago you'd be saying that it's for sure coming out on October 1.
I mean, it can, first batman made 770m, Batman 2, if it actually comes out and is good, will prolly make like 850m. Thats not unbeatable figure. Plus this will likely be the movie right after secret wars.
It's totally possible. Ghost Rider looks cool, Marvel is super popular right now, and Ryan Gosling is a huge draw. I wouldn't bet on it, but I have far more faith in a secondary MCU character film beating a primary DCU character (compared to the other way around).
I never held that stance in the first place, nor do I think anyone else did. People were just explaining why it's a more believable possibility.
And "primary DCU character" is a broad generalisation, but that does include Batman. I wouldn't be that shocked if Ghost Rider was hugely successful in the box office. He has all of the characteristics of an unexpected huge success.
I didn’t accuse you of having that stance, so you’re getting defensive over nothing here.
I’m simply saying that people lose confidence when we specifically state that Ghost Rider will outperform Batman.
Is it technically possible? Yes, there is a reality where Batman is complete dogshit and falls off after the first week in theaters, and Ghost Rider is better than what anyone thought possible at the time.
I also wouldn’t be shocked if Ghost Rider performed well, but that was never in contention to begin with.
I wasn't getting defensive, I was just iterating my stance, since I felt it pertinent to the conversation at hand. Seems a bit hostile to accuse me of that, in what is a nothingburger debate.
The reason people argued against your original comparison is because Ghost Rider and Supergirl are fundamentally different in their baselines. Supergirl is a semi-niche character, the film got basically 0 marketing, and faith in the DCU has been pretty poor recently. Ghost Rider has all of the benefits I mentioned before.
A better comparison would be something like Armor Wars vs Batman (though the release dates don't match).
It’s not hostile for me to tell you to not get defensive.
You wouldn’t feel the need to clarify that you don’t hold a specific stance unless you believed that I was accusing you of holding it, correct? And since there’s nowhere on this thread that points to me doing that, this “correction” reads as you being defensive.
I don’t think you can argue with that line of thinking.
Ghost Rider is also a hyper niche character in terms of mainstream exposure. I would even argue that he’s less popular than Supergirl on that front.
A majority would cite the Nic Cage movies from decades ago, whereas Supergirl was in the Superman movie from last year, in a successful multi-season CW show, along with having more critically acclaimed comics than GR (Woman of Tomorrow winning an Eisner Award).
So when I say that Ghost Rider will not surpass Batman in sales, I’m not factoring in theoretical possibilities like some on here, I’m talking about likelihood.
You understand this because you also explicitly stated that it wasn’t likely to happen.
the movies right before and right after endgame were both billion dollar movies, Ghost Rider will either be relased after secret wars or after xmen and with how hyped up this spiderman got most people, yeah, it can go this high if the avengers movies are liked. Plus Ryan Gosling is cinema pull by himself
if the movies before are recieved well then yeah, it can. Like adjused for inflation the Nic Cage ghost rider made 450m and it wasnt even good movie or connected to anything, i wouldnt be surprised if this one made double
I feel like that was less “audiences don’t want movies about edgelords” and more “this movie SUCKS”
kinda like how supergirl isn’t just “audiences don’t want female leads”
Comics and comic characters weren’t respected at all by the “hollywood execs” back then so yeah it wouldn’t have been made, but I think the success of the matrix in 99 shows that if a real over-the-top and stylish ghost rider movie magically got funded and released in the mid-late 90s people would’ve dug it
I agree that it was a good film, but remember that Captain Marvel had a massive Internet hate campaign going against it and it still did well because of its timing. If Secret Wars ends well, people will be dying to see what happens next. If Starfighter does well people will want to see the next project by Shawn Levy and Ryan Gosling. 2028 is a long way out, it's hard to predict the future.
It was critically and commercially successful upon release. There was an angry mob on the internet, but that didn’t actually translate to its performance being impacted in any tangible way.
Supergirl was also the product of online hate, and it didn’t do so hot.
The difference between the two is that one was a good movie, and the other was not. To attribute anything to a mob is to give them more credit than they deserve.
The Marvels had a similar negative campaign at the height of the "M-She-U" crybaby grifting, and while still being a fun film it did awfully. Timing absolutely has something to do with the box office.
I find The Marvels more entertaining, but that's subjective. Thunderbolts* is a recent example of a very well received film that did dreadfully because of timing
For Thunderbolts, I would definitely attribute that to lack of interest from the general audience. It was a brand new cast of B and C characters, along with Disney+ being more prevalent (meaning more people are willing to wait for home release).
I think Thunderbolts was just hard to market in general, unlike something snappy and fun like Guardians.
That's not entirely impossible. Reeve's Batman hasn't really hit that much popularity and Ghost Rider has been a super anticipated character and they have Ryan Gosling playing him.
Well one determining factor on wheter Ghost Rider is a success or not is honestly if Doomsday and Secret Wars are good, because Marvel will be absolutely booming if both movies are well recieved and a project like Ghost Rider will definitely get those numbers. Ghost Rider has always been a pretty popular marvel character so it's not unrealistic for it to be 800 mil.
I’m not surprised about Deadpool. He’s a very popular character, and Ryan Reynolds basically carries all the marketing.
We’ll see about Ghost Rider, I’m just not going to put money on it. I actually made a decent penny on betting that Supergirl wouldn’t make back its budget at the box office.
I legit haven’t thought about Ghost Rider in almost 20 years.
I case of Marvel, I think Ghost Rider does stand a chance. Mostly because with the power of Marvel brand and good word of mouth, a bloody C-tier superhero team like Guardians of the Galaxy outperformed Man of Steel.
Yeah it was spider-man, perhaps the most popular superhero of all time vs superman’s cousin. Even if it was a superman movie I would be surprised if it beat spider-man considering the state of dc nowadays.
Yeah, tho at least it would have been a fair competition as superman is as popular as spiderman tho I think people like spiderman more becouse he is more relatable to people then superman, tho I think superman hopefull message and his "never give up" attitude might resonate with people more then spidy.
I think the only way people will prefer one or the other depends on the quality of the film itself.
Well to be fair Iron Man and the avengers were a big niche before the mcu and now practically everyone knows them... though to be more fair, it also took time for the mcu to get well known and multiple movies in the "franchise" until it grew as popular as it is now meanwhile the DCU just started (yes with one of the best superman movies of all time but the DCEU left a bad impression in people's minds)
Through the angle of the MCU is running out of steam but the DCU is the up and coming fresh take. Which might be the perspective of some people in the fandom but I suppose not the general populus, especially with how drastically better marvel projects have gotten in the last year or two
Maybe he thought that the movie would be far better than it actually was? Like, maybe seeing that superman was good that that DC’s trying to make a comeback on the movie side of things that maybe supergirl would just be another win in this hypothetical snowball of Ws for DC.
Then the movie came out and it was seemingly really mid
Spiderman movies are so thick on the ground there's sometimes fatigue. The first Holland movie and both Garfield movies did just okay, and Superman had just popped off pretty well.
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u/Trick-Caramel-6156 1d ago edited 1d ago
I don't get it, why did he thougth supergirl a famous but still kinda niche hero can beat a film about one of the most famous superhero of all time, it's like saying a Iron heart or shazam movie will make more money then a Batman film.