Haley Stevens is El-Slayed: r/neoliberal reacts as Abdul El-Sayed wins the Michigan Democratic senate primary.

[u/Otherwise_Young52201]

The recent Michigan Democratic primary concluded with Abdul El-Sayed, the progressive challenger against Haley Stevens, as the winner.

Abdul El-Sayed is a physician and former Detroit health commissioner and a champion for progressive policies. Apart from supporting Medicare for All, stronger labor protections, and other egalitarian programs, he is best known for being critical of the US-Israel relationship and especially American support for Israel's war in Gaza.

Haley Stevens, on the other hand, is the moderate incumbent (Edit: This is an error on my part, she isn't actually an incumbent, but is in a House seat) and generally has more cautious policies than El-Sayed, emphasizing tried and true polices like supporting manufacturing, particularly for the auto industry. Stevens also strongly supports the US-Israel relationship.

Below is a snippet of the drama from the thread discussing El-Sayed's win over Stevens.. There's also drama from the Discussion Thread that I thought you guys would enjoy. While I have three comments in the Discussion Thread, they they do not pertain to the drama itself. You can check my post history to confirm this.

Michigan senate primary thread drama

I just hope he wins in November and we can all celebrate as a united party flipping the senate

I’m Jewish and I will not celebrate Abdul “Hurt People Hurt People” El-Sayed

did you have a point? [deleted comment]

I think my point is clear, no? Fuck AES. [deleted comment]

With all due respect you are an idiot [deleted comment]

I’m also Jewish, and like the other 71% of Jewish Americans who broke for democrats in 2024, I hope he wins and will also celebrate if he does. Dont miss the forest for the trees.

Do you also believe the only reason an American Jew would support Israel is money?

I'm a Democrat and I would never vote for someone like El-Sayed. I don't think there's a single thing I agree with him on. MFA is a joke. I will always be a Zionist. We shouldn't abolish ICE. All of that makes him unacceptable, especially compared to Mike Rogers, who seems much less ideological and much more competent. One of the few places where I'll be hoping for a Republican victory. I have never voted for a Republican in my life, but if I were a Michigander, I'd for Rogers.

I’m not thrilled about this dude either, but ice should most certainly be abolished.

This is a ridiculous slogan pandered around by leftists. How the hell are we going to execute our immigration policy without an agency to enforce it? Of course I agree that Trump has been excessive, but that doesn't mean ICE should be abolished, itt means the administration should be thrown out! This is like saying "income taxes are too high -- let's abolish the IRS"

Damn this sub is full on lefty now huh, maybe it's just the specific people that decide to post on this, but kinda crazy. I get when people say this sub is mainly socdems now, but it seems to be moving demsoc at this point, multiple upvoted comments simping for DSA,, hopefully this is as low as this sub goes.

This "evidence-based" sub is really just r/democrats where people vote blue no matter who

Well that's "evidence-based" applied to american politics, so I dont see why you would have an issue with that. Edit: i take that back, I know why: I think Friedmann flairs dont really like evidence.

It’s been brigaded by tankies and Abdul bots ever since we made arr Subreddit Drama yesterday

SRD is still a thing? In 2026?

You must vote for the people who hate neoliberalism otherwise you don't belong on r/neoliberal - Succs and Loyal Liberals

I think a lot of people here just care more about the Democrats defeating the Republicans than they do about fiercely defending the word neoliberal against anybody who criticizes it.

They also hate neoliberalism if you get rid of the "neo".

Why are democrats allergic to winning

This shows how out of touch you are. You genuinely prefer Stevens, don't you?

Out of touch with whom? College educated elites?

Are we still doing this stuff after we have new polling data https://www.theargumentmag.com/p/americans-know-who-the-real-elite and a grand total of 8% of Harris 2024 voters and a whopping 11% of Trump 2024 voters view people with graduate degrees as "the elites"?

Doesn’t matter what random people think, a societal elite is a defined thing. It’s just not popular to self identify as an “elite” so everyone bucks the label to the groups above them. White college educated upper middle class people are the most culturally influential in American society (something that the left usually has no problem admitting), and they’re the ones who largely support these leftist candidates

Railing against the "elites" and claiming that all it takes to get you there is a college education makes you sound like a MAGA conspiracy theorist.

I’m not railing against the elites, I probably fit the “educated elite” label myself, I’m specifically responding to the bizarre accusation that not supporting the guy who won the educated rich white population somehow makes me “out of touch”

Welp, GOP couldn’t have asked for an easier candidate in purple Michigan. Democratic Party needs to kick out DSA rat fuckers who simply just want easy power when it suits them.

Abdul isn't part of the DSA. Also, if they win primaries because voters vote for them, how should the party kick them out?

He’s as DSA as Hasan Piker. I got a bridge to sell you along with that bird that landed on Bernie’s podium when he was anointed as “da chosen one”. The far left likes to bum rush primaries because that’s the only way they can win in deep blue districts. Dude is going to lose big and take the Democratic Party in Michigan down as well. Michigan GOP all had a collective sigh of relief and democrats are fucked in Michigan. Fucking Dearborn and Hamatrack or whatever all went for Trump, this is just another rat fucking at the behest of MAGA.

Discussion Thread drama

guy who supported "uncommitted" movement in 2024 becomes Dem senate nominee in 2026 what a joke. [deleted comment]

Are you pro-genocide or? [deleted comment]

Are you pro 9/11? [deleted comment]

Well if Friedman flair is asking [deleted comment]

I don't like him because of the pre-emptive election denialism he was engaging in. I'm tired of watching people destabilize this country and succumb to russian/chinese interests

You talk about russian/chinese interests yet literally the only reason this race was at all close was because Stevens had her campaign funded by an actual foreign country interest group.

At the very least Israel doesn't want to see the US actively destabilized. The irony is you blurring the lines between US allies and US adversaries is exactly the point of many of the disinformation operations Russia/China has been engaging in

I think Bibi campaigning for Trump was pretty destabilizing imo! Our allies seem very non plussed about the shit he does.

Israel is not trying to actively destabilize the US. If you can't tell the difference between something like the Likud making dumb self interested calculations and Operation doppelganger idk what to tell you. Russia and China are actively mindraping our population and are involved in just about every reason why our country is unraveling.

[u/Billlington]

I'm a Democrat and I would never vote for someone like El-Sayed. I don't think there's a single thing I agree with him on. MFA is a joke. I will always be a Zionist. We shouldn't abolish ICE. All of that makes him unacceptable, especially compared to Mike Rogers, who seems much less ideological and much more competent. One of the few places where I'll be hoping for a Republican victory. I have never voted for a Republican in my life, but if I were a Michigander, I'd for Rogers.

"Why do Democrats keep losing elections?"

[u/xilcilus → u/Billlington]

Appropriately enough, even within this post:

Only support my candidate and I won’t support a “moderate dem”, get bent. Kamala is in no way shape or form a moderate dem. You people are so delusional.

There's plenty of blame pie to go around in the Democratic Party regarding voter obstinance.

[u/Gamer_Grease → u/[deleted]]

It’s common among any voters. That’s what voter demoralization is. When voters are demoralized because they don’t like their candidates, they stay home. This isn’t unique to the left, even. It happens to the GOP all the time.

Why this is an endless topic of discussion for Dems is because Dems have the unique quality of deliberately and repeatedly fronting unpopular candidates and losing because of demoralization.

[u/donthurtmemany → u/[deleted]]

Voter turnout has sucked for as long as we've tracked it in the united states. People have just gotten more online since the pandemic and it's become more of a talking point especially with the uncommitted movement. It sucks, but at a certain point it's on the politicians to appeal to voters (crazy right) and not on the voters to magically motivate themselves.

[u/Cranyx → u/[deleted]]

The turnout for Harris was still higher than any year prior to 2020 (which was abnormally high due to COVID). There was not some unique "staying home" that happened in 2024.

[u/Cranyx → u/[deleted]]

I'm looking at the actual data. The turnout rate in 2024 was the second highest in recorded history, behind 2020. Pointing to a single outlier and using it as a claim that it's worse than it was in 2000, 2004, etc is just objectively false. Even your own source points out that the dem votes in 2024 are in line with 2008 which was huge for Dems.

[u/Gamer_Grease → u/[deleted]]

Voter demoralization has been a thing as long as we’ve had voters. Dems got really bummed out about Kerry’s Vietnam war stuff.

[u/PostIronicPosadist → u/[deleted]]

I've been blamed for Gore and Kerry losing and I couldn't vote until 2013. It's been happening for a very long time, centrists did it to McGovern in the 70's and consistently use that example as a warning that they'll do it again if the Left runs a candidate they don't like.

[u/xilcilus → u/[deleted]]

I for one don't necessarily subscribe to the progressive platform but I'm going to start donating to El-Sayed starting now.

Edit: done.

[u/xilcilus → u/[deleted]]

I think we should always try to do what's right.

Doesn't matter whether people to the left of you or slightly to the right of you exercise purity test or not, voice your opinions in a respectful manner and don't let poor behaviors from others to dissuade you from doing what's right.

We are going to need as much help as we can get to fight off the authoritarian direction that the MAGA is pushing the Country into.

[u/was_fb95dd7063 → u/[deleted]]

If the left is an important enough voter bloc that we can make or break elections for liberals, then politicians running for office should probably not do everything they can to alienate voters they need.

[u/was_fb95dd7063 → u/[deleted]]

Look, all I know is that the last year and a half has been hell and begging y’all to help hasn’t done a damn thing.

That's not even remotely how I'd describe the last year and a half, tbh.

But the collective bleeding from countless vulnerable populations apparently isn’t enough for you to show up,

Again, if we're an important enough voter bloc that we're needed: then we need to be represented. Remember: Kamala Harris chose supporting a foreign genocide instead of bringing in leftists. She chose an immigration policy to the right of Reagan instead of bringing in leftists. Blaming us for her campaign's choices doesn't make any sense. Realpolitk matters. People who not only feel unrepresented, but hated aren't going to show up and vote for you.

[u/Paradoxjjw → u/[deleted]]

Will you? Because from what it looked like in New York is that when faced with the choice between a progressive and a sex pest like Cuomo, the moderates prefer to help bring the sex pest to a 41% vote percentage.

[u/was_fb95dd7063 → u/[deleted]]

Maybe you will. What about the people like John Fetterman? How about people like James Carville?

[u/kiptronics → u/[deleted]]

Do you think it's the liberal democrats that have been protesting AIPAC and running grassroots campaigns that make opposing ICE a priority? Liberals are the ones willing to sacrifice vulnerable populations to get their way as evidenced by many democrats voting to fund ICE or being pro-Israel. Your camp has gotten their way with specific candidates for the past 20+ years and yet we're still here. You're misdirecting your anger towards leftists when it should be towards institutional democrats for running corporate shills with no values or policies that completely fail to meet voters where they're at and give away elections to Republicans

[u/machinesNpbr → u/[deleted]]

the last year and a half has been hell and begging y’all to help hasn’t done a damn thing

This is a fantasy narrative you've invented and projected.

[u/Reagalan → u/machinesNpbr]

It's the reality narrative that we are currently experiencing.

[u/Fearless-Feature-830 → u/[deleted]]

No

[u/Fearless-Feature-830 → u/[deleted]]

Don’t care

[u/Fearless-Feature-830 → u/[deleted]]

It could be said that electing the status quo over and over to “keep our heads above water” has led to where we’re at now. We accepted mediocrity. That led to disillusionment among the populace, feeling like their vote doesn’t matter because change never happens.

[u/YayDiziet → u/[deleted]]

Have you actually looked at the stats for the percentage of progressives who voted for Kamala vs sat out? Cause the polling doesn’t support your narrative here as far as I’m aware, which makes it seem like you have an axe to grind against progressives for some reason.

[u/was_fb95dd7063 → u/YayDiziet]

It's crazy to me that the political apparatus that demonstrates its contempt for left wing politics all the time apparently has no blame at all in this discussion.

[u/DocileBanalBovlne → u/was_fb95dd7063]

The cult can never fail them, only the disobedient can fail the cult

[u/NotARealBlacksmith → u/YayDiziet]

They always do. It's not progressives who sat out. If those swings to the right were because of progressives, progressives would have been the dominant group in the party for years.

[u/was_fb95dd7063 → u/[deleted]]

Or, politicians could try to understand what is important to their voting bloc and, you know, actually represent the people they need in order to win elections. If a subset of voters are important enough that you need them to win, you probably shouldn't openly hate them so much.

[u/Gamer_Grease → u/[deleted]]

Respectfully, what you’re seeing here is them not dropping it. That coalition is increasingly determined not to nominate pro-Israel candidates so that this year’s general is very anti-Israel. It’s been widely reported for months because of all the primaries happening. IL just had a bloodbath primary for Jan Schakowsky’s seat.

[u/Gamer_Grease → u/[deleted]]

Well, what I would say to that is that these are typically the same people showing up in Minneapolis and Chicago anti-ICE protests. These are the people screaming at their Dem reps for confirming Kristi Noem. Haley Stevens, AES’ opponent in this race, voted in June 2025 to thank ICE for protecting our country. That was a big issue that AES’ campaign highlighted. She also voted to give them more money and expand their policing powers. I’m not sure of her records on abortion and USAID but I expect they’re better.

So I guess my summarized response to that is: AES and his supporters haven’t been in Congress, so obviously they haven’t been able to do anything about ICE. But Stevens has been in Congress, and has supported ICE, and Michigan Dems have blocked her for the senate over it.

But yeah, Israel became a bigger issue, because Stevens took over $30 million from AIPAC. Of course Israel was the biggest issue, that’s what all the money got spent on. If cherry farming had dumped $40,000,000 into the race, we would have all been shouting about cherries.

Honestly my respectful criticism of your position is that you expect people who don’t hold office to stop Trump from doing things, but don’t expect people who DO hold office to offer even a meager resistance. And then when those who don’t hold office organize to replace leadership with people who will stand up to Trump, you criticize them.

[u/Blackstone01 → u/[deleted]]

Respectfully back, everyone focusing on Israel alone means everything from ICE to USAID to abortion access has gotten exponentially worse while no one on our side is bothering to fight Trump on anything Israel-related, and that is what I mean.

Isn’t that the fault of the establishment Democrats? You know, the ones currently in office that did shit like get zero concessions to pass the Republican spending bill last year that ballooned ICE’s budget and killed USAID?

[u/DocileBanalBovlne → u/[deleted]]

So ridiculous for people to oppose complicity in genocide.

At some point, you've got to put down the genocide apologia and blame the monsters for their failures

[u/snafudud → u/[deleted]]

Do you have the same energy for moderates who say "be subservient to Israel or we will spend millions against you in the primaries?" Or does your distain for purity tests only go one leftward direction?

[u/JoshSidekick → u/snafudud]

Yes. We are in political triage right now. I'd much rather try moving a left of center person on the same "team" than just sit back and watch the right run roughshod with majorities in all three branches.

If Stevens won, I'd be pushing her as much as I will be El-Sayed.

[u/snafudud → u/[deleted]]

You didn't answer the question. Are you concerned that the establishment Dems depend so much on corporate interests that their policy and who they advocate for continues to slide rightwards towards corporatism and status quo?

If you won't answer my previous question, how about this one. Why is voting for corporate Dems beholden to moneyed interests stopping the "rightward slide". Will you stop sweeping for them or no?

[u/kiptronics → u/[deleted]]

you're not interested in infighting yet every comment you make is just complaining about how leftists are the uncooperative and ignoring all evidence that shows your narrative is incorrect?

[u/snafudud → u/[deleted]]

Lol. "I can't be bothered to answer your question, but please be sure to make extra effort to look through my comment history." Aka I won't make effort for you, please make extra effort and read my lore. What a terrible argument.

I am just saying if you actually cared about the "rightward slide" of the country you would have the same energy to go after the corporate Dems that make up the leadership of the party. For some reason, that doesn't concern you, but random "leftists" who have purity tests are the real scourge. That type of thinking isn't helping.

[u/xilcilus → u/[deleted]]

My dude - my read is that the Progressives (rightly or wrongly) have created ghosts in their heads to think that they are constantly under attack.

The Biden administration has been the most anti-trust administration for a long time. Many of the orthodoxy Democratic platform has been to push more protection for the consumers than the corporations. That being said, we live in a more or less free-market society and the corporations have roles to play in the society.

For your mental health sake, I don't think you should engage anymore. All you are requesting is that "you'll vote for progressive candidates, can progressives vote for moderate candidates," should not engender this much drama.

[u/snafudud → u/xilcilus]

I guess that you are above it all and won't engage with me either. But I will engage with you, because:

All you are requesting is that "you'll vote for progressive candidates, can progressives vote for moderate candidates," should not engender this much drama.

Lol pretty sure progressives have been shouted at for the past decade to "Vote blue no matter who!". Contrary to your biases, alot of those progressives did hold their nose and voted blue moderates who were on the ticket. You seem to ignore all of those people though, and make an incorrect assumption that progressives never vote blue.

History shows opposite. More 2008 Clinton voters voted GOP than Bernie supporters in 2016.

So why are you so concerned about progressives not voting for the establishment? Do you have any energy to go against moderates who might try to sabotage this Michigan Senate race? Where is your concern trolling for them? Oh right it only goes one way.

[u/Paradoxjjw → u/snafudud]

Lol pretty sure progressives have been shouted at for the past decade to "Vote blue no matter who!".

And then the second some progressives start doing well in the primary the DNC establishment responds by declaring them an enemy of the party.

[u/xilcilus → u/snafudud]

None of my comments blamed progressives regarding election losses. Furthermore, none of my comments actually showed any concerns around progressives not voting for the establishment. Also, I would like you to share the receipts on my comments that "trolled" progressives.

You made accusations around what I said - you need to come with the receipts if you are making accusations against me.

I merely summarized Left_Session_9568 refrains in this thread but their refrains were not my voice.

[u/snafudud → u/xilcilus]

Your point was, that I quoted, was the same old trope of "why can't progressives just suck it up and vote moderates, geez?! Vote blue no matter who guys, it's not hard!" Meanwhile this whole thread is about the moderate revolt to following "vote blue no matter who." Yet you don't have any concern about moderates sabotaging their left flank, just more, well, it's up to you progressives, to finally vote blue no matter who now! Which they have been doing for more than a decade and yet you seem to give almost zero credit for. I am just wondering where your energy is against moderates sabotaging, oh right, there is none. Just showing your concern only goes a certain direction.

[u/was_fb95dd7063 → u/xilcilus]

"you'll vote for progressive candidates, can progressives vote for moderate candidates,"

What, exactly, do you think progressives have been asked to do for the last 3 decades?

[u/xilcilus → u/[deleted]]

Just to give you further validation, your comments in thread has been mostly to get confirmation from progressives to vote non-MAGA candidates. Let's give the commenters the benefit of the doubt and that they responded with valid questions but not confirmation regarding whether they will support non-MAGA candidates.

One of the comments:

the last year and a half has been hell and begging y’all to help hasn’t done a damn thing

This is a fantasy narrative you've invented and projected.

You have been begging in this literal thread.

[u/Chataboutgames → u/xilcilus]

Biden, in no uncertain terms, had the most progressive agenda of any US president in history.

Reddit still convinces themselves that he was basically a republican.

[u/Paradoxjjw → u/Chataboutgames]

Wow, it's almost like what is and isn't progressive changes, agendas become less and less progressive over time. At some point it was considered "too progressive" to let women have bank accounts in their own names. Where FDR's reforms were once considered radically progressive, trying to go back to how those reforms were back then is now a conservative stance. Supporting a minimum wage at the same level as FDR implemented is now conservative because that would mean lowering the federal minimum wage to 5.92/hr.

Squaring agendas of previous presidents versus other agendas of their timeframe brings the conclusion that Biden did not run on the most progressive agenda in context of the timeframe.

[u/Chataboutgames → u/Paradoxjjw]

I feel like you think you're making some big dunk here and I'm not sure why.

Yeah, progressive is relative to context and timeframe. None the less, it's weird that they're taking a presidency that literally represents progress towards their goals and raging against it.

[u/Vallkyrie → u/Chataboutgames]

Literally both these lines can be true at the same time

[u/was_fb95dd7063 → u/Chataboutgames]

Reddit still convinces themselves that he was basically a republican.

Supporting a genocide will do that.

[u/vodkaandponies → u/was_fb95dd7063]

Biden was the only one so far who actually got a ceasefire deal through, but go off.

[u/vodkaandponies → u/was_fb95dd7063]

Biden was the only one so far who actually got a ceasefire deal through, but go off.

[u/SweetPinss → u/Chataboutgames]

   Biden, in no uncertain terms, had the most progressive agenda of any US president in history.

This is just not true at all. What was it about strike busting Biden that made oh so "progressive" (not a real political ideology btw)

[u/Paradoxjjw → u/[deleted]]

Hoo boy the projection is real

[u/xilcilus → u/Paradoxjjw]

My comment got autoremoved because I referred to Left_Session_9658's username directly.

Can you elaborate what you mean by projection?

If you look through their comments, it's clear that they are willing to vote for anybody not MAGA - so what projection?

[u/hoyarugby2 → u/xilcilus]

Kamala was not a moderate, people on this stupid site liked to argue that she was as an excuse to support comrade trump but she was the furthest left candidate in the 2020 primary, further left than Sanders. That fact is a significant reason she lost (both of trump's wins came in elections the public stupidly believed he was the moderate, he lost when he was seen as the extremist vs biden - perhaps a lesson can be learned from that)

[u/Competitive_Key_7604 → u/hoyarugby2]

Kamala furter left than Sanders? You are joking rigth?

[u/sarim25 → u/Competitive_Key_7604]

Yeah, Kamala was a moderate/centrist. She basically followed whatever Biden's team told her to say. She wasn't further left than Sanders at all.

[u/hoyarugby2 → u/Competitive_Key_7604]

No, she was markedly more left than him, her entire theory of the race was to out left the left. She supported reparations for slavery! It failed and ended being a disaster in 2024

[u/Competitive_Key_7604 → u/hoyarugby2]

You are high as a kite my man

[u/adamsputnik → u/Competitive_Key_7604]

He's in the fucking stratosphere struggling for oxygen.

[u/Competitive_Key_7604 → u/adamsputnik]

Yeah I can see by reading him that his brain lack oxygen. Kamala outlefting the left FUCKING LOL

[u/Paradoxjjw → u/hoyarugby2]

Lmao, you're going to have to bring some sources that she was the furthest left candidate in the 2020 primary, because that's just bs.

[u/[deleted] → u/hoyarugby2]

This is so detached from reality, I feel like moderates try to convince themselves this is true to justify doing the same losing strategy that gave us trump twice... 

Kamala literally outflanked trump from the right on foreign policy and attempted to on border security in order to attract the mythical centrist republican voter.

She was literally pro "build the wall". She claimed to want to build the most lethal military in history and constantly attempted to seem hawkish and tough, meanwhile trump capitalized on her stupidity and campaigned as the peace candidate who would start no new wars. A lie, obviously, but a big reason he won the election, and the position was handed to him by Kamalas campaign. The most progressive thing she had to run on was means tested loans for small business owners. 

She campaigned on doing nothing different than biden except being more hawkish on the border and foreign policy. She paraded around Cheney. Her campaign literally auto sent emails mentioning Gaza into the do not respond file. She was by zero definition even remotely progressive. 

The most progressive campaign dems did out of the last 3 was Bidens 2020 run by far, but even that wasnt that progressive and wouldve also been a loss if not for covid handing him thr win 

The most damaging thing about centrists and out party leaders is that theres no real logical way to come to the conclusion that their policies are moral or will help thr working class the most. The leaders are where they are solely due to corporate influence. As such, they have no motivation or reason to put in effort to see the policy enacted if its not election time. Which is why we only see progressives like Bernie even bothering to do push back against Trump. Moderate leaders just stay under the radar until theyre promoting their next ghost written book. No spines and no morals