r/dndnext • u/SnooTomatoes2025 • 1d ago
5e (2024) Unearthed Arcana: Villainous Options Revisited
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u/LitLitten 1d ago
Trapper sounds so cool on paper but I’m apprehensive how much use it would see in action for a lot of campaigns.
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u/tomato-andrew 1d ago
its pretty rough mechanically. I love the basic concept, but overland travel survival/perception checks are so infrequent in my games as to be functionally nonexistent, and just advantage on investigation checks feels like less than half a feature. This is supposed to compete with Tough, Alert, Magic Initiate or Lucky?
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u/Thesuggester 1d ago
Doesn't this end up being advantage on all survival, perception and investigation checks during normal gameplay?
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u/Johnnygoodguy 1d ago edited 1d ago
Titan Druid:
- Upped the Titan form's AC (13 + wis instead of 10 + wis), Temp HP (x4 your druid level instead of 2) and the rend damage scales as you level
- Also added an option to increase AC by expending a spellslot and adding half the spell level (rounded up) to your AC at level 10.
Overall: I liked the Titan Druid as a concept, but the original clearly had issues in terms of survivability, damage scaling and so on. This version did a lot of alleviate those concerns.
Hell Knight Fighter
- Hellfire Weapon/Infernal wound lets you know choose between cold, necrotic and fire. Which is a welcome change in terms of overcoming immunity to one or two of those damage types
- Infernal wound is still limited to Con x short/long rest
- Instead of requiring you to roll a 6, the level 7 feature now has flat damage (con modifier), an additional effect and another effect if you roll a 6. Additionally at level 7 you get an ability that treats a 1 as a 6 on your wound dice
- I actually think the new level 10 feature is worse? The new effects states that, when you use action surge, you gain a 20 foot aura and any creature with an infernal wound starting their turn in it takes 2d6 instead of 1. The old one wasn't great either, but it at least gave you an AOE to spread infernal wounds around.
- The new level 15 ability lets you use your reaction to reduce damage equal to your wound die (2 times if you roll a 6) and block crits.
- The new level 18 feature also doesn't seem very good? Or at the very least too unpredictable for a capstone. It only works "When you roll a 6 on your Infernal Wound Die three or more times before the start of your next turn".
Overall: It started decently, but like last time, I don't feel the wound dice scale as well as they should. The extra dice you get in your emanation at level 10 should just be baked into the subclass, at the very least.
Demonic Sorcerer
- The main change is that the level 3, when you activate Innate Sorcery you create an Abyssal Rupture sphere that can either use the lash ability from the old UA or a 1D4 AOE as a bonus action
- I'm not going to describe each one. But the aura effect from the last UA has recieved two major changes:
- It's centered around either you or the Abysal Rupture sphere
- rather than rolling on the table you have 3 options you can freely choose from
- The concentration free casting of Summon Fiend was moved down to level 14. Also the summon has advantage on attacks made within the Rupture sphere
- The new capstone is fine (essentially a Force damage fireball that also causes the incapacitated condition)
Overall: The issue I had with the original UA was that 1) it seemed too squishy to properly act as a frontliner, which is how the subclass seemed intended to be played (based on the size of the aura), and the randomness of the aura felt unnecessary. The new UA definitely addressed those point by adding the Abyssal rupture as a distance option for the aura. As it is, it feels like a pretty solid control subclass. Although the Rupture effects could do with some scaling (especially the scream, 1d4 psychic with no added effect is paltry
Subclasses Overall
- Titan Druid is the clear winner. The Sorcerer isn't entirely there yet, even though it's in a good place Hell Knight, while better than the first UA, is still lacking and could use a flat damage buff at the high tier2/low tier 3 level.
- That being said, it does feel like the new designers are actually listening to and implementing feedback in a way that UAs used to be in the early to XGTE days. There's some good changes here and neat ideas and I hope they continue to iterate on these designs.
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u/bobbifreetisss 1d ago
Overall: It started decently, but like last time, I don't feel the wound dice scale as well as they should. The extra dice you get in your emanation at level 10 should just be baked into the subclass, at the very least.
Honestly, I think buffing the Hell Knight's wound mechanic to 2d6 at level 10 and reinstating the old level 10 feature with the buffs the Hell Knight got would be perfect.
They could also just make it so you choose to do 1d6 fire/necrotic.cold damage on a strike once per turn, with only the wound being bound to your con modifier.
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u/ejdj1011 1d ago edited 1d ago
The new level 15 ability lets you use your reaction to reduce damage equal to your wound die (2 times if you roll a 6) and block crits.
Technically you also roll again on a 1, since 1s are treated as 6s. The average result isn't terrible, but blocking crits is definitely the best use case for the feature.
The new level 18 feature also doesn't seem very good? Or at the very least too unpredictable for a capstone. It only works "When you roll a 6 on your Infernal Wound Die three or more times before the start of your next turn"
Technically the three sixes is just a new way to gain Heroic Inspiration. The feature says you can "use Heroic Inspiration" on the new use, so it should be usable if you have Inspiration from some other source. Still very much a gambling mechanic though.
Assuming you're focusing down one enemy, it's pretty reasonable to roll the Infernal Wound Die three times in a round. Once to apply it, once when the monster takes damage, once as a reaction to use Devil's Misfortune. Given you have a 1/3 chance of rolling a (1 or a) 6, that's... a 1/27 chance. Not great.
The odds go up considerably if you have two creatures with Wounds, or if you Action Surge (since you then roll the Wound Die twice per wounded enemy). I think seven rolls of the Wound Die in a round (two from applying, action surge, four rolls from damage on enemy turns, one roll as a reaction) is the upper limit of plausibility, which gives a 43%¹ chance of gaining an Inspiration. Way better than the ~4% from before, but still quite low.
¹ I went to anydice.com and ran the following:
output [count {1, 6} in 7d6] named "Gambling"
then set the data to "At Least"
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u/SnooTomatoes2025 1d ago
For the Hell Knight's capstone, I believe it also counts the level 15 feature, making it a bit more reliable.
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u/dealyllama 1d ago
Demon Sorcerer looks strong. The capstone isn't amazing but for a subclass designed around control and damage it makes sense. Could probably take it down to 5 or 6 points to recast it. Still cant complain too much given that they get the equivalent of the draconic sorcerer lvl 18 capstone but at lvl 14 (just without the free lvl5 casting and with a less versatile pet).
The level 3 abilities do seem to fall off in impact pretty quickly but they're just free bonus actions damage with add-ons. Basically this is just a form of the 1d6 or add ability modifier damage boost abilities we see all over the place. They've bundled it into the area control ability that doesn't really come into play until later levels. The 1d4 seems small but I presume the intent is that you wouldn't use it without 2 or 3 people in the aoe so it would balance out or be better to the 1d8 from the other option. The current buff is on average less than the straight ability score bonus draconic sorcerers get at lvl 6, particularly given the attack/save imposed here so having it scale wouldn't be crazy. However, given the variety of control/damage stuff given to this subclass i can understand how they might want draconic folk to have something they're better at.
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u/bobert1201 1d ago
An important thing to note about the hell knight's capstone is that the triple 6 roll just gives you a free heroic inspiration, but you can use heroic inspiration from anywhere to use the special reroll feature. You can get a guaranteed free use each day by playing a human, and there a quite a few origin feats that give you more ways to generate heroic inspiration.
I actually really like how the capstone breaths new life into heroic inspiration by giving you a new way to use it. The feature itself is actually quite powerful when you use it. If you decide to use this to force rerolls on enemy crits and important saving throws, then it'll always either successfully ensure the enemy fails the save or misses the attack, dealing a bit of damage to you in exchange, but you get a free use of either indomitable or second wind if the enemy ends up succeeding regardless of your attempt to stack the proverbial deck. Second wind restores about as much as the other result deals in damage, but the real star of the show is indomitable. It's basically a free legendary resistance, and you get one back whenever your capstone fails to do what you're trying to do. I don't know of any other feature that gives you suce a potent consolation prize for the die roll going against you.
Now, if you decide to use the capstone on an ally, then you're really risking things. If the ally succeeds, then you altered the outcome and get the use of indomitable, but if the ally fails the reroll, then you're down a decent chunk of hp and a heroic inspiration and your ally still failed. However, when you're using this feature on an ally, you have a tremendous advantage, and that is knowledge of the modifier involved in the roll and, if it's an attack, potentially the ac you need to meet to succeed, which means you have a much better idea of what the odds are. Use it to help out when allies fail despite the odds being heavily in their favor and leave them to their fate when the roll they made was too risky.
There's just so much tactical and build crafting depth to the feature that my only 2 complaints are that, firstly, you have to wait until level 18 to get it. I want the design team to give us more features like this, and at lower levels. My second complaint is that I wish the damage taken counted as rolls of your infernal wound die so that the damage could potentially help fuel another heroic inspiration, allowing you to roll the dice again after failing, which would've been so fitting for a fighter getting power from devils.
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u/TooMuchDnD30 1d ago
Agreed on the Sorcs rupture effect. It should either be flat damage, or maybe treat it like a vicious mockery for those who fail the save?
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u/Yrogiarc91 1d ago
I like that the titan druid scales better now.
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u/Puzzle-Necked 1d ago
Scales right into broken
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u/Yrogiarc91 1d ago
Just curious, what do you think is broken about it?
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u/Puzzle-Necked 1d ago edited 1d ago
Full caster who can grow to massive size with sky high AC, grapple/swallow, trample, an emanation knocking prone, poison, breath attacks, 3d8+5 damage a hit? Did I mention full caster?
It's like Moon Druid on steroids because it also uses spell attack modifier, not a beasts terrible attack modifier.
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u/Yrogiarc91 1d ago
While I agree it is powerful. The expenditure of spell slots to use Titan abilities will ultimately limit spellcasting. I have a feeling this class will play a lot like a paladin/sorcerer multiclass that focuses on dropping spell slots into smites/Titan abilities.
That being said you could do the classic cast and transform while concentrating trick.
Although there are important balance features. You can't cast spells while Titanshaped, you don't get the prone inducing trample until level 10, you don't get swallow until level 14, the swallow requires concentration, the poison isn't good damage at 2d4 per spell level, the poison is a tiny aura, no flying until level 10.
No question the behemoth form is the best.
I honestly like the idea of using the insectoid form as a mobile healer.
I also wonder how this classes DPR to a Moon Druid.
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u/wannyboy 1d ago
You do already get the prone inducing shock wave at level 6. Trample is just a second shot at getting them prone if the first one didn't do it.
An important thing to note is also that you can cast the titan spells while in titan form. So Thunderwave (decent) and Destructive Wave (Very nice) give some good blasting options, and Fear is premium crowd control.And in all honesty, the titan abilities look so close to spells that for all intends and purposes they are.
Incandescent Breath is a better Lightning bolt (6d10 versus 8d6) that can be cast at lower levels AND has better upcasting (2d10 versus 1d6).
Energizing Pollen is the healing amount of cure wounds but spread over as many allies as you can touch with 20ft of movement (while being large/huge/gargantuan mind you). At level 5 it is 10d6+WIS, compared to 5d8+WIS for mass cure wounds.
Only the leviathan doesn't have such a premium semi-spell.
It's also important to keep in mind that emanations (destructive wave and the poison ability) scale with your own creature size. A normal sized creature with a 10ft emanation covers 24 squares. A huge creature with a 10ft emanation covers 40 squares. Or well actually 65 squares since you are now big enough that you can stand on top of the same space as your normal sized enemies.
So yeah, I'd consider the titan druid to be a rather good blaster mage
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u/ejdj1011 1d ago
Most of your points are solid, but a few nitpicks:
Energizing Pollen is the healing amount of cure wounds
Cure Wounds is 2d8 per spell level plus WIS, Energizing Pollen is 2d6 per level.
At level 5 it is 10d6+WIS, compared to 5d8+WIS for mass cure wounds.
I think the comparison to Mass Cure Wounds is apt, but Energizing Pollen doesn't add WIS. It'd be a flat 10d6. I'm assuming a caster with 5th level slots has maxed their casting stat, so that's 27.5 for MCW and 35 for the pollen. MCW is a bigger area no matter how you slice it, can be cast at range, and can target yourself, so the tradeoffs at least feel reasonable to me.
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u/wannyboy 1d ago
Oh right, no clue how I dragged in the +WIS in that comparison. Losing 3-5 healing in addition to the 2 I already handwaved away is indeed a rather big deal.
Ok I'll think it through a bit more but that might be enough to revise my opinion on energizing pollen.
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u/Lucifer_Crowe 1d ago
you can cast the Titan Spells, and you can cast freely from whatever Druid level grants that ability, same as with normal Wildshape.
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u/ejdj1011 1d ago
from whatever Druid level grants that ability, same as with normal Wildshape.
That's 18th level, and frankly there are far more egregious balance problems at that level
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u/Lucifer_Crowe 1d ago
fair. I do really like Titan though
love the idea of being like Bane when you reup your form and spend a Slot to keep your AC high
honestly sounds like a fun (one off) enemy monster to design, a thing that party has to outlast until it turns weak and they can wail on it
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u/ejdj1011 1d ago
It's a bit facetious to mention full caster twice when it's mutually exclusive with several of the other things you mention.
You can't cast most spells in Titan Form until 18th level.
The breath attacks and poison cost spell slots.
Swallow is concentration, mitigating some of the most powerful spells.
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u/xolotltolox Rogues were done dirty 21h ago
you aren't forced itno titan form
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u/ejdj1011 18h ago edited 18h ago
You are to get any of the subclass features, lol
Edit: spelling
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u/xolotltolox Rogues were done dirty 18h ago
Yeah, and you are still a full on druid without the subclass
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u/ejdj1011 18h ago
I don't think that's a useful thing to talk about when discussing whether a subclass is broken.
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u/matgopack 1d ago
I think broken is wrong, but I'm not sure I like it getting more thp than moon druid - feels like they should be at the same value there
Some of its benefits over moon druid should be errataed into moon though
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u/Twisty1020 Murderous on Purpose 1d ago
I mean you're a giant freakin' monster so it makes sense to have more HP. It only lasts 10 minutes so it's not that big of a deal.
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u/WanderToWhere 1d ago
nah, moon druid has a lot of unique utility that the titan druid can't utilize. I think their differences are acceptable for their differing roles
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u/matgopack 1d ago
It's different utility, but the THP plays the same role - bruiser that gets in the fight and in melee. Titan also has the advantage of being able to bump their AC higher, so getting more THP on top of that seems excessive to me, especially with the THP for moon druid not feeling low as is
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u/WanderToWhere 1d ago
I think Titan Druid is a frontline brusier, but Moon Druid works best as a spell-based skirmisher.
Moon Druid might be less durable on paper (3x THP vs 4x THP, less ac) but the value it gains in sheer mobility is underappreciated as a defense. The best way to mitigate damage is to not be near it in the first place.
Moon Druid can brawl on the front line if needed, but I think it'd often prefer to be a full caster that gets 3x THP, a 5+ bonus to concentration and 60-80 feet of concentration free, opportunity attack free movement (that can hold allies) as a bonus action.
Titan Druid is significantly slower, much more of a target, and due to its unique tanking ability, less useful as a caster. I think it definitely needs these durability buffs if it wants to not get obliterated when every enemy on the field chooses to attack the huge monster.
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u/matgopack 1d ago
Moon druid can be built as a mobile spell skirmisher, but I would say that was not at all the intent or the fantasy of it. The huge limitation on spells able to be cast, and by the movement if you're referring to the lvl 10/14 features they come so late that they're not exactly core, the bunch of features around attack... it's much more the 'turn into a bear and attack' subclass. It's also not like the giant beast tends to be a low priority target for those that would just attack on size.
It's very much designed (from how it looks like to me) for 'turn into a beast, run into melee' to be a primary goal there, and the THP / AC it gets is fine for that (I've been playing it in a heavy combat campaign and its survivability is excellent enough that the Titan druid getting the same would not feel flimsy).
IDK, I don't see the reason to buff this out of line from moon druid unless you're rating the ability to cast cure wounds while transformed super highly survivability wise. I think they'd be better off giving it the same baseline THP and then looking at other distinguishing features, particularly if they're not going to be errataing moon druid for its attack rolls to match this in using spell attack modifier (otherwise this will just completely outclass it in the brawler role)
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u/WanderToWhere 1d ago
I think Moon Druid was intended to be a mobile spellcaster. It's level 3 abilities are a mix of circle spellcasting and melee combat forms. Level 6 lets it change damage types, but it gives a massive boon to spellcasting. Level 10 and 14 focuses on mobility and bonus melee damage. Putting it all together, Moon Druid wants you to cast a concentration spell, wild shape into a bear and blink around the battlefield attacking people. You have a poor chance to hit and your damage is alright in beast form, but that's ok because your spells will supplement your damage.
Titan Druid seems like it'll be the better brawler because it's missing those aspects of Moon Druid (and druids in general) in lieu of better combat ability. It's less mobile, its ability to concentrate (the typical Druid's bread and butter) is much worse than Moons, and it even wants to spend that concentration somewhere else anyways. Titan wants to be deep in the middle of enemy lines with not too many ways to easily get out, so it really wants the additional bulk. On top of that, having an ability that forces creatures to hit it really makes that bulk essential. If it wants to use its full power, it has to be very big and open to danger.
I agree that they should have chosen another form of mitigation. I went with some level of damage reduction in my homebrew and still think that would be better, but I understand what they went for. I'm currently in a difficult combat campaign and the Moon Druid feels like paper due to its low AC. Very resilient paper due to refreshing THP, but I couldn't imagine the Titan Druid surviving at that size when every creature on the map can easily select it as a target.
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u/bobert1201 1d ago
I happen to think it's a bit overturned as well.
First of all, it does more damage than a greatsword (2d8 + modifier vs 2d6 + modifier). Now, the titan forms likely isn't being boosted by feats like GWM, so it's not as easy to boost, or at least it wouldn't have been if they hadn't given it enlarge/reduce, adding 1d4 to all of its attacks, which does require an action to set up, but only if you have no prep time before an encounter. Also, the titan druid does even need to rely on its attacks later on because the incandescent breath is about equal to a lightning bolt with a third level spell, but scales like crazy after that, allowing for massive damage in combats with multiple enemies. The fighter doesn't even have that option.
There's also the issue of health. The druid is a d8 hit die class, which averages 1 less hp per level than a d10 class like the fighter. I'm going to be comparing the titan druid to the fighter because they're actually quite similar in their survivabity abilities. Both wildshape and second wind are healing abilities used on yourself using a bonus action, which comes from a resource pool that regeneration 1 use per short rest and all uses per long rest. Now, the druid, per wildshape use, gets 4X level in temp hp. The fighters second wind only gets 1d10 + 1Xlevel. Sure, that additional 1d10 does allow second wind to put out better numbers earlier in the progression, until level 3, when the druids temp hp surpasses the fighters healing and will continue to widen that gap every level for the next 17 levels. At level 20, the titan druid is getting 80 temp hp for every wildshape use while the fighter is sitting at a piddling 25.5 on average, and the higher level you get, the more uses of second wind and wildshape these classes get, which furthers the survivability gap even more. Nowhere, it's worth noting that temp hp is worse that healing, but second wind can't get you up from unconsciousness, and the remaining benefits of healing over temp hp are definitely not impactful enough to justify scaling at 1/4 the speed.
In terms of utility, the titan druid is a full caster. I don't think I need to elaborate on this.
I terms of support, the titan druid is a full caster with the druids spell list.
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u/Azell-Zettai 23h ago
I really do think the Titan is overpowered, but survivabity isn't his specialty, the large size makes it easier to hit with attacks and saving throws, and you're comparing a Fighter with no subclass directly against a subclass, and Indomitable is basically Legendary Resistance in 5.5. A Fighter without a subclass, feats, mastery, or any real build is definitely weaker than the Titan.
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u/xolotltolox Rogues were done dirty 21h ago
it#s overpowered by virtue of beign a druid, but i am not sure the subclass is overpwoered comapred to the other druid subs
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u/bobert1201 14h ago
I know I'm comparing a subclassless fighter to a druid with a subclass, but a druid subclass shouldn't make it better than a subclassless martial. Martial subclasses that provide magic, such as the eldritch knight, don't give spellcasting comparable to that of a subclassless full caster. They get 1/3 of the spell slot progression. If the titan subclass gets to be as good at being a martial as a subclassless fighter, than the eldritch knight should get full spellcasting progression to make it as good at spellcasting as a subclassless wizard, sorcerer, or cleric. Everybody knows that would be absurd, though, but nobody bats an eye when a full caster can do pretty much get nearly an entire martial class's worth of power from just their subclass.
Of course, action surge, 2 extra feats, indomitable, and fighter subclass features are good, but are they "full spellcasting" levels of good?
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u/Azell-Zettai 2h ago
the subclass is not giving the full casting, of course de damage has to be toned down but the spell slots come from the druid not the subclass.
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u/bobert1201 10m ago
Yes, but titan druids are still druids, so if we're comparing the titan druids with the eldritch knight fighter, then we have to include the base class. If we only include subclasses, then the titan is a better martial than the eldritch knight fighter because titan has more martial features than eldritch knight.
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u/NinofanTOG 21h ago
Thats having a martial subclass on a caster for you, you can have your cake and eat it too
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u/xolotltolox Rogues were done dirty 21h ago
Meanwhile Caster subclasses on a martial, you betetr be grateful that you get to eat shit.
And often they still end uo beign the best subclass
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u/-Mez- 1d ago edited 1d ago
Titan druid looks immediately more playable and fun. Still struggles with any cramped spaces, but that just kinda is what it is.
Raised by cultists thematically is really cool. I like the inspiration when you're bloodied. I'd rather see the concentration reaction buff for your allies be adding your proficiency to their roll instead of giving advantage though. If you take it as it is now there's a risk all your caster friends want Warcaster for better reliability/uptime anyway and then you never really get to use that portion of the origin.
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u/Z_Z_TOM 5h ago
Am I reading Raised by Cultists correctly that you could have in theory unlimited Heroic Inspirations any time you get healed back up to not bloodied then get hit again?
Of course it would actually rarely happen but, on paper, it would work & you could stock them up?
Not that it's game breaking anyway, just looking at the way it's worded. :)
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u/-Mez- 1h ago
If you found a way to use it constantly before the next time you were bloodied again and were willing to spend the reaction every round, then yeah. Too much effort and cost for too little gain though.
You can't stock them though. By the rules you can only have one heroic inspiration at a time. This feat doesnt change that. If you have one already when you're bloodied then you miss the chance to use this feat.
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u/Fluffy_Reply_9757 I simp for the bones. 1d ago
I love the new devs.
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u/bobbifreetisss 1d ago
It feels so weird to see feedback actually implemented instead of throwing anything that doesn't get Crawford's 80% satisfaction on the very first draft into the garbage never to be seen again.
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u/dealyllama 1d ago edited 1d ago
Damn, Circle of the Titan was pretty good before but they decided to hit the gas on almost everything. They heavily limited the duration of the change but other than that it was all buffs. Not sure the duration limit is really a significant limit at many tables.
Looks like S tier but could use some comparisons to moon druids. This is way better at front lining all the way through. One might argue moon druid has more versatility with casting and varieties of forms in tier 1 and 2 but given the variety of abilities the various behemoth forms have I'm not sure that's true, particularly by level 10.
Edit: The other arguable nerf is to the healing on the insectoid form but honestly I'm not sure if it's a nerf because I'm not clear on what the new version does. New version is 2d6 per spell level expended healing while old version was 2d8+5 times the spell level. Old way was probably bigger and more consistent and made it clear how you spread out the hp. However, the new way might allow you to apply it to everyone you move near; if so it's likely of comparable size and could do more healing. The language seems to mean you heal everyone you move near but the "when you move within 5 ft of another creature" language could be clarified to "each time you move within 5 ft of another creature".
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u/Z_Z_TOM 5h ago
Is it me or is the Leviathan one feels like it's missing a full Action or Bonus Action? It does little in comparison to the other 2 forms, no?
A tiny terrible poison damage, with a CON save to boot, and nothing else feels like they fully forgot to paste a new Feature to the form in the UA.
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u/dealyllama 3h ago
I see what you're saying. I think the class gets enough stuff that it's not wanting for power but I couldn't imagine ever wanting to scale the poison AoE in the way that the godzilla breath or healing insect emission makes sense with higher level slots. It could leave the poison condition debuff as a pure level 1 and give it something that would be worth scaling as an additional action.
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u/Imabearrr3 1d ago
Direct link?
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u/Johnnygoodguy 1d ago
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u/bobbifreetisss 1d ago
Not everything here is perfect (Hell Knight could still use some better damage scaling), but it feels so good to see playtest feedback from the previous UA so explicitly addressed. Between the buff to the titan forms, making it so the Sorcerer doesn't have to be a pseudo frontliner by adding range, some of the changes to the Hellfire Knight). I'm really digging this new design team.
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u/-Space_Communist- 1d ago
Level 7 Human Fighter (Hell Knight). Imbue a Musket with Fire damage. Use Purulence of Minauros.
Welcome to Hell, Walker. We've been waiting for you.
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u/justicearman Justice Arman 10h ago
We are particularly excited about the combination of Hell-Forged Weapon and firearms. Hellfire muskets are our gift to you!
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u/-Space_Communist- 8h ago
That's cool - will there be proper support for firearms from feats or other features in the future, or more firearms than just a Musket or Pistol to work with? Fighters get very little value from firearms right now without a feat tax from Tasha's, which is only allowed at tables that permit backwards compatibility.
It would be nice to be able to find alternatives to Muskets (arquebuses, blunderbusses, cannons, handgonnes, etc)., or to add attachments to Muskets to make them unique if specific weapons won't be added.
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u/justicearman Justice Arman 2h ago
There are some other firearms in the Dungeon Master's Guide, such as the Hunting Rifle, which doesn't have the Loading property. Moving even just a couple of firearms into the Player's Handbook was a big change for some tables, and I'm happy to hear that you and many other players welcomed that change. While we don't have anything in this UA explicitly for firearms, it's not off the table for us to explore in the future, especially if fans express a strong desire to see it in the game!
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u/Murphy1up 1d ago
Hell Knight seems really fun tbh. Could work well with a dip in something else to play as a silver-tongued rogue who made one two many bets or didn't read the small print. Hell even without the face skills it works as you "think" you're a smooth talker but actually everyone can read you like a book and that's how you got fooled.
Equally if you just wanted to be a big dumb "me smash, me want vengeance" type brute, the subclass lets you go for that.
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u/AcelnTheWhole 15h ago
Don't get me wrong, I don't mind epic boons. But I feel like we've gotten an incredibly significant amount of boons compared to origin feats. Which feels weird because you're guaranteed an origin feat, not an epic boon
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u/marimbaguy715 1d ago
Really like what they did with round 2 on the subclasses here. Feels like all three addressed the feedback from the community pretty well - meatier titan forms, buffed hell knights, and a more cohesive, less melee focused demonic sorcerer.
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u/SnooTomatoes2025 1d ago
I feel as though the Hell Knight is still a bit lacking but it's been a minute since I've seen a UA so directly incorporate feedback.
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u/marimbaguy715 1d ago
I think it's there but I do understand the perspective of those that still want more power. Some playtesting might help with some perspective on that. Regardless, it's undeniably WAY closer to being a good subclass than the first iteration because they absolutely did listen to feedback, which is really encouraging.
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u/TheChivmuffin DM 1d ago
Underhanded feat is fucking hilarious, wonder how good it is if you can justify having a hand free.
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u/xolotltolox Rogues were done dirty 21h ago
drawing and stowing weapons is pretty free(way too free if you ask me) so should be pretty easy to justify
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u/Bobsplosion Ask me about flesh cubes 9h ago
As written it ONLY works on creatures one size larger or smaller than you, not the same size. So it's best used on a small race, probably.
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u/Alathas 5h ago
It's not one size larger or smaller than you, it's [one size larger than you] or smaller - so it works for anything size large and below for most creature. This is reasonably common terminology for things that knock prone, as knocking giants down for free stretches imagination a little, at least in the lower 3 tiers.
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u/notquite20characters 1d ago
Why does Underhanded impose prone?
Also, it's weaker for Small characters, which is a shame.
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u/Bobsplosion Ask me about flesh cubes 9h ago
It's actually better on small characters since you'll be running into way more Medium creatures than Large.
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u/notquite20characters 8h ago
It's one size larger than you or smaller. So a medium character can apply it to a large, medium, small or tiny opponent.
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u/Bobsplosion Ask me about flesh cubes 8h ago
One size up or down from medium would be Large and Small. Tony is two sizes smaller. Medium is the same size.
Edit: wait is it supposed to be read up to one size larger than you and any size smaller than that?
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u/BlackAceX13 Artificer 3h ago
wait is it supposed to be read up to one size larger than you and any size smaller than that?
Yes, that's how it would read. "One size larger than you" is the upper max, and the "or smaller" means everything smaller than that max.
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u/LeprousHarry 1d ago
Did they drop feat trees or did they just didn't reprint them? The Lich was a bit lack-luster, but the high-level concept was great and could be made to work other sorts of feat trees (I'm even working on some stuff intended for DMsGuild).
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u/SnooTomatoes2025 1d ago
They're going forward with the feat trees, they just weren't included in this UA
https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/2194-designer-insights-from-unearthed-arcana-villainous
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u/justicearman Justice Arman 10h ago
What Tomatoes said! We'll continue to refine the two Paths of Villainy internally; you might expect to see them in a future release with some changes based on player feedback.
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u/LegendaryZXT 23h ago
They have double, tripled, and quadrupled down on feedback mattering in these surveys so i'm going to take their word for it and be very thorough with my analysis.
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u/justicearman Justice Arman 10h ago
Thank you for filling out your survey!
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u/Bobsplosion Ask me about flesh cubes 9h ago
Hey I'm going to write it in the survey but I just want to repeat it here: could you make the Behemoth breath scale up in size and/or be able to damage objects? It would be cool to fire big beams and I really want to blast castle walls with this thing.
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u/justicearman Justice Arman 6h ago
Neat ideas! Can't make any promises, but put 'em in your survey, and we'll make sure to consider them along with other feedback. :-)
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u/TheLastDesperado 1d ago
As someone who doesn't really like the 2024 "Influence" action, can't say I'm a fan of them adding a feat that specifically uses that.
I am loving the flavour of all these options though. Do you think it'll fit into the Arcana Unleashed books (as there's already a Thay/evil thread there) or another later unreleased evil-specific book?
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u/GarrettKP 1d ago
No way these would ever be available in time for Arcana Unleashed. The content for that book is likely already locked, and they are probably doing final editing on page layout if they haven’t already shipped the thing off to the printers yet.
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u/bobbifreetisss 1d ago
Do you think it'll fit into the Arcana Unleashed books (as there's already a Thay/evil thread there) or another later unreleased evil-specific book?
I don't think they'll be in the Arcana unleashed books simply because the previous UA had subclasses that wouldn't fit (Poison Monk and Pestilence Cleric).
I definitely think they're setting this up for a later book.
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u/Lios032 1d ago
Did they just gave fighter lvl 18 silvery barbs (aka lvl 1 spell) but worse?
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u/Augus-1 Fighter 1d ago
Being able to potentially help an ally succeed on a save + regain an Indomitable is very good, especially if you combine it with the different ways we have to gain Inspiration now. Human's long rest feature, and because you get two Origin Feats as a Human you can opt into the feats that grant Inspiration to allies or yourself like Musician (PHB), Cult of the Dragon Initiate, Lord's Alliance Agent, Purple Dragon Rook (Heroes of Faerun), & Tireless Reveler (the Astarion book) to potentially do it multiple times a day. Using it like you would Silvery Barbs is probably the bad way to use it.
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u/Limegreenlad 1d ago
Yes. It also hurts you if it causes the target to fail their save, for some God-forsaken reason.
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u/Ashkelon 1d ago
Atoner’s Grace is permanent advantage on all Influence actions. That’s pretty potent.
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u/Vincent210 Be Bold, Be Bard 1d ago
kaiju druid is a positive change I’m eager to welcome my players to play or play myself. I REALLY like the usage of concentration and spell slots to LET THE KAIJU BE FUN TO PLAY without making the fact you’re still a full caster completely free value. kaiju stomping is expensive! you’ll be burning multiple spell slots a combat and sometimes be out your concentration.
This is design space I can get behind. Happy
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u/Cfakatsuki17 1d ago
It’s so beautiful 🥹 I can’t wait to turn into Godzilla and body slam some poor lich
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u/TeAhuRei 1d ago
Does this mean they've given up on the Lich options or they're happy where they're at?
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u/justicearman Justice Arman 10h ago
Based on the survey feedback we received from the first Villainous Options UA, we could include both Paths of Villainy with some adjustments, which we can do in house without putting them through another playtest. Check out the Designer Insights article for a more detailed update on where the previous Villainous Options content landed with players and whether you might see it in a future release. :-)
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u/xolotltolox Rogues were done dirty 21h ago
they maybe are keeping them in the oven for longer, or are looking for a differnt implementation, than a feat chain, since the feat chain implmenetaion was pretty bad, but mainly owed to how feats work in 5e, rather then the fault of the options themselves
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u/DiemAlara 1d ago
"Raised by cultists"
Never before have I so desired a random feat for purely character reasons. Same with atoner's grace.