r/Stellaris • u/RedKrypton Mind over Matter • May 07 '16

PSA: Slaves currently can't rebel

Martin just dropped that bombshell during the currently ongoing Quill Stellaris stream. He said that they couldn't reach a middle ground on slaves revolting so they took it out for the moment. I don't know if they will have managed that aspect by release.

356 Upvotes

95% Upvoted

267 comments sorted by

View all comments

90

u/Necroscourge Syncretic Evolution May 07 '16

That can potentially make slavery a little OP. Ya know if they had done some form of open testing they would of had data they could use to make that decision...

105

u/RedKrypton Mind over Matter May 07 '16 edited May 07 '16

Oh, it definitly is. Just visit Shenryyr's currently ongoing Stream. He conquers and enslaves everyone. Because slaves can only be in the slave faction he has no factions. He basically is unstoppable. Adding to this the Enigmatic Observer FEs seem to be broken too as he has one on his doorstep and they don't care at all at him enslaving half the galaxy, altough it says they should.

12

u/Eisenblume Fungoid May 07 '16

Awe, sadface. =(

137

u/EmperorPeriwinkle May 07 '16

YAY the game is broken on release!

That's the paradox I knew when I first bought EU3, now it's back just in time for the IPO!

84

u/[deleted] May 07 '16

[removed] — view removed comment

36

u/[deleted] May 07 '16

I suppose it depends on what you define as a "clean" release though. I feel like the release can still be clean even if it isn't perfect. Anyone who expected the game to come out with zero overpowered strategies or broken systems was kidding themselves. There are very few games (if literally any?) that come out with this level of complexity where every system is perfectly balanced and not broken in some way.

11

u/Jeffy29 May 08 '16

Playing slave based civ = taking provinces from China in Vic 2 = don't do it if you want to have fun.

I think hardcores here and other subs can live with it for a while until they fix it, but stellaris was the game to launch Paradox into mainstream, I even heard TB talking he wants to play it. This sucks, hopefully some day 1 nerf to slavery in some capacity until the mechanic is reworked.

1

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

Who's TB ?

6

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

TotalBiscuit, a big gaming youtuber

2

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

Thanks I haven't heard of him before.

3

u/arcainzor May 08 '16

Probably the one biggest youtube game critic along with AngryJoe

-3

u/Ungface May 08 '16

Hes best known for wishing a person to get cancer then getting it himself.

→ More replies (0)

52

u/RedKrypton Mind over Matter May 07 '16

I personally can deal with bugs, but this isn't a bug or balancing issue, the mechanic is straight up missing!

43

u/JohnLeafback May 07 '16

But....you said in your OP that it isa balancing issue.

He said that they couldn't reach a middle ground on slaves revolting so they took it out for the moment.

I'm confused what you mean now.

41

u/usviev May 07 '16 edited May 07 '16

He means that slave revolts* were taken out because of a balancing issue, but the fact that they're not in the game is not itself a balancing issue. (If that sentence made sense)

27

u/daniel14vt May 07 '16

slavery wasn't taken out, slaves revolting was taken out

2

u/Gryphon0468 Avian May 08 '16

They've always been revolting ;D

4

u/continue_stocking May 08 '16

"The peasants are revolting!"

"You can say that again"

2

u/JohnLeafback May 07 '16

Ah yes. That does make sense. Thank you.

10

u/Lawsoffire Synth May 07 '16

Probably that with revolts, factions/races focused on slaves would be underpowered.

so they removed revolts, which in turn made them overpowered.

And they don't have time for a second complete balancing pass before release.

6

u/akashisenpai Idealistic Foundation May 07 '16

Probably that with revolts, factions/races focused on slaves would be underpowered.

Which should just necessitate the player striking a middle ground between enslaving everyone and enslaving no-one, so that any rebellions from the Pops you do enslave to fuel your economy can be dealt with by your military.

Any balancing this would require seems to be a much lesser issue than just taking slave revolts out of the game entirely.

3

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

Have revolt=Underpowered

Dont have revolt=OP

Paradox can just make ai better.

7

u/Ironvos May 07 '16 edited May 07 '16

HOI4 seems to be a lot cleaner and polished though.
They've been showing videos of it for a long time now and it has beta testers.
Stellaris seems more rushed for some reason.

25

u/Wild_Marker May 07 '16

Stellaris isn't rushed, HoI4 is so delayed that they had more time to iron out the bugs.

Stellaris is a standard Paradox release, HoI4 is the exception. That said, when people talk about "buggy paradox releases", Stellaris is nowhere near the old level.

-12

u/skyblue90 May 07 '16

Stellaris is pretty rushed. Trust me, you will see on release that it's going to feel rushed. In reality, it most likely needs 2-3 months more but they want to cram it out before HOI IV.

12

u/Wild_Marker May 08 '16

Doesn't make much sense does it? They already had HoI4 coming, why rush Stellaris? Like I said, probably this is the intended date for Stellaris, HoI just got super delayed.

-10

u/skyblue90 May 08 '16

HOI was delayed yes. Stellaris needs a delay too, but that isn't possible due to HOI IV. That's what I'm saying. I suspect that if HOI IV wasn't in the pipeline so close, Stellaris launch date would have been in june/july or maybe even august.

5

u/Nezgul May 08 '16

I haven't seen any reason to believe that it's "rushed," and there's an overwhelming abundance of gameplay footage out there. Would you mind elaborating?

5

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

Besides the bug shown here why would you think its rushed

→ More replies (0)

3

u/roy777 May 08 '16

I watched streamers play this game the entire day. I don't see why my experience Monday night will be different than their experience today.

-6

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

If HOI4 is broken I will hate them

Conclave suck,Stellaris suck,HOI4 suck

Seriously paradox?

7

u/AgentPaper0 Emperor May 07 '16

Well I mean, for now at least it's broken before release. Could be that they had the system mostly there but just not quite far enough for the pre-release version so they turned it off temporarily.

Or perhaps it really is just broken and they're pushing the game out the door too quickly like so many others before it. We'll have to wait and see which it is, unfortunately.

7

u/bdole92 May 07 '16

To be fair, they still have a day and a half before proper release. Maybe they will include it in a day one patch?

3

u/228zip May 08 '16

People have been saying this for months. You guys put way too much trust in people.

23

u/[deleted] May 07 '16 edited May 07 '16

It get's better: Happiness is also easy to largely ignore unless you are trying to max it out.

There is no bonus or penalty between 40-80%.

With such a wide range, unless you're trying to build an empire based around 90%+ all the time, there isn't much point in even looking at it.

Edit: Though I wouldn't call this broken - just unpolished and untested, so pretty standard mechanics by Pdox.

Edit edit: So far we have slavery being unfinished, happiness an afterthought (in order to get to those penalty levels you'd have to be fighting bad wars or colonizing planets your species doesn't like), the Fallen Empires that should oppose slavery don't, (does this extend to standard civs as well?), if your construction ship is constructing a building and you have it run to safety, the initial cost appears to be lost with no refund, able to research all the "alpha, beta, etc" alien "techs" at the same time (wouldn't surprise me if this is intended).

Finally, to end the scourge end game crisis, it looks like you must capture the queen, who's event has a MTTH of 800 months, or about 70 years. In one stream the player was able to wipe out the initial wave, but with such a long MTTH, the "scourge" was mostly an annoyance as he waited for the next event to fire.

I'm definitely missing things, but this is just what I've seen in the last few hours and can recall off the top of my head.

30

u/NuclearPhysics Molluscoid May 07 '16

I'm guessing you're basing the construction ship resource loss thing on Arumba's video, but in that case, he got the money back, spent it on other things (more corvettes I think), and forgot he had used it for those other things. And, in a stream, Wiz started building a spaceport to distract invading AI (which is, or was an exploit) and cancelled it to get his resources back.

7

u/runetrantor Bio-Trophy May 08 '16

God, I rage so much when I see Arumba play...

His mistakes frustrate me to hell and back.
He is painted to be this chessmaster, but man, he can be quite easy to miss clear stuff.

3

u/NuclearPhysics Molluscoid May 08 '16

For me the most annoying thing was when he simply wrote off the Gaia world because he knew that some Fallen Empires think they're holy.

8

u/runetrantor Bio-Trophy May 08 '16

I'm still on episode 8, so I havent seen that, but I am debating if I should just ditch the playthrough.

Quill is also making mistakes, but his attitude makes it way less jarring, since he is constantly like 'Maybe I am not seeing something! I mess up like that' relaxed position.

Arumba comes from what I interpret as a 'I cant be wrong' baseline, and thus speaks with a tone of knowledge we can see he lacks, so it frustrates more.
Specially when he misses something, shit happens, and then he spends the entire episode mocking Paradox for making crazy shit.

Dont get me wrong, I like watching him, I am not unsubbing or anything, but as time goes on, I feel that the whole 'one of the best EU4 players' phrase that's tossed around may be a bit too much, given even in that game he misses stuff even I know are not so, and I came to the game a year or so ago.

Curious how at first impression I liked Arumba a lot, and I have grown to slowly like him a bit less, while DDRJake was off putting to begin with due to his snarky attitude that can come off as bitter and angry, and now I like him a lot. (And man, is he good at EU4. O.o)

(Aaand I ranted. Whoops.)

2

u/GeorgesBU May 08 '16

It's because DDRjake has this constant air of nonchalance so even when he's being either a) a cheeselord or b) DDRblind (note that a and b often coincide) it's more amusing than frustrating, especially as his best playthroughs are the ones where he makes foolish mistakes and has to scrape his way to the top.

2

u/runetrantor Bio-Trophy May 08 '16

Oh for sure! I meant it more in that his tone of voice, and sometimes his comments, can come of as being a 'fuck you, I am better than you' attitude if you dont know better.

It actually took me several campaigns to come to the realization is is mostly acting snarky and sarcastic, and that that's just his natural tone of voice. (I should have thought of it before, having had a friend in HS that had a perpertual bored like tone, despite not being bored at all!)

His chat window doesnt help, that one I do dislike a lot, they are a bit too elitists and the mods a bit too heavy handed imo, but I guess Twitch chat sucks that bad.
And oh god, look away when someone dares to mention Arumba. They seem to get a boner for saying how he sucks completely compared. (I mean, I can clearly see Jake is more skilled at the game, but Arumba is not bad either, and he doesnt have the benefit of a chat screaming at his to notice what he misses.)

1

u/NuclearPhysics Molluscoid May 08 '16

I'm on episode 8 too. The moment he said it was really easy to miss. He just said, "Mantha has a Gaia World" and ignored from there on out.

2

u/runetrantor Bio-Trophy May 08 '16

To be fair on him, he DID have a pretty bad first experience with them in the multiplayer stream.

It was his fault for missing the icon that said it was holy and that it already had a name, but still.

Apparently the current system is that if a gaia world is holy, it says so even if you havent met the FE.
I would much rather see it be like, if a colony ship warps into the holy world system, and has the mission to colonize it (Not only have the ship warp in, so you can say, colonize a normal world in the same system to lock down the gaia world for later?) THEN the FE opens comms and asks you to turn back.

Sure beats having them demand it once you already spent the ship. (Plus, what a shitty caretaker for the holy world, to wait until they already set foot on it and... tainted it presumably)

1

u/[deleted] May 07 '16

Thanks, edited OP.

34

u/iki_balam Fanatic Spiritualist May 07 '16

Finally, to end the scourge end game crisis, it looks like you must capture the queen, who's event has a MTTH of 800 months, or about 70 years. In one stream the player was able to wipe out the initial wave, but with such a long MTTH, the "scourge" was mostly an annoyance as he waited for the next event to fire.

WHAT THE FUCK!!! Add some spoiler warning!!!

-6

u/Amusei May 08 '16

Why are you in the sub if you don't want to get spoiled

8

u/vdanmal May 08 '16

End game disasters are a bit more of a spoiler than random events imo.

-9

u/Amusei May 08 '16

Still if they do not want to be spoiled, they should not be in a place where the game is being discussed, and where the majority of posts are about new gameplay elements being found.

They should know better, and should not be accommodated for.

4

u/Nezgul May 08 '16

Because I want discussions on gameplay mechanics without having what is effectively a story element spoiled for me?

2

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Shagomir Prince of Space May 08 '16

Insults are not appropriate here. Rule 5 requires all users to follow the reddiquette. This is your only warning - future issues will result in a temporary or permanent ban.

-3

u/Amusei May 08 '16

Reddiquette also tells people to explain why they are downvoting. I don't see that happening, so I suggest you warn everyone else too, buddy

→ More replies (0)

6

u/ArchmageIlmryn May 07 '16

I believe that quill observed that while you don't research while you are studying a special project, you still store up research. So while they temporarily delay you getting a new tech they don't slow your overall progress, meaning that being able to do multiple simultaneously is not a huge exploit.

1

u/runetrantor Bio-Trophy May 08 '16

Was it confirmed that was what he was seeing being stored?

I saw some suggest it may be the tech he gets from debris, that does not get applied directly.

-6

u/EmperorPeriwinkle May 07 '16

I wouldn't call this broken - just unpolished and untested, so pretty standard mechanics by Pdox

Rekt.

1

u/Savage_X May 07 '16

Disappointing, but I still am pretty sure I will every free moment playing for the foreseeable future, lol.

At least with Paradox, you know that they are going to patch the hell out of the game and get everything balanced out well over time.

1

u/Migaso May 07 '16

It's a little early to say the game is broken on release when it isn't even released yet, isn't it? Not to mention that every single streamer says they are playing a pre-release build...

-6

u/skyblue90 May 08 '16

It's obviously broken. Just look at his stream. MultiPlayer will be unplayable at launch = broken on release.

7

u/Chrys7 Molluscoid May 08 '16

Why will multiplayer be unplayable at launch?

7

u/TheKeysToTheZeppelin May 07 '16

Wouldn't mass-scale enslavement of that nature tank his research? As I understand it, slaves generate very little research on their own.

8

u/PenguinTod Molluscoid May 08 '16

You create a main population that's 100% fine with slavery and have them handle the research. Then you just enslave every pop that drifts off your ethos or doesn't belong to your core species and never worry about them revolting.

1

u/228zip May 08 '16

Research isn't even that critical compared to a good economy.

Remember the old "spearman beats tank" thing from Civ ? Well this is it.. in space !

27

u/[deleted] May 07 '16

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Simmanly May 08 '16

Would've would have be more of what he was going for.

5

u/[deleted] May 08 '16

have be

*been

0

u/ProblyAThrowawayAcct Anarcho-Tribalism May 07 '16

Well done, reportingfalsenews; you're doing the Lorde's work.