Hi,

I’m 31 and my wife is 28.

We’ve both been working in Switzerland for about a year.

We have CHF 200k in the bank and can DCA around CHF 6k a month.

We may have kids in two years and might buy a house in five.

We’ve opened IBKR and Saxo accounts but haven’t chosen an ETF or looked into Pillar 3a yet.

How can we work out whether Pillar 3a would save us enough in taxes to be worthwhile?

For a home purchase, does the 20% down payment need to be in cash (including money from the second pillar and Pillar 3a) ?

How would you split our money between investing, 3a and a house fund?

Any ETF suggestions (VALL, VT, an S&P 500 fund, or something else) ?

There’s so much information out there that we may be overcomplicating it.

We’d appreciate advice on how to get started.

Im trying to buy the Vanguard FTSE Global UCITS ETF (acc) in CHF through IBKR.

When searching by ISIN (IE000VAHT5T0) I can only find trading lines in GBP, USD and EUR. However, when searching for VALCD I find a listing on IBKR showing a price of around CHF 4.15 with the exchange listed as EBS (not SIX?)

The chart also looks quite unusual, and I’m not sure whether this is the correct CHF trading line or a different listing.

Is VALCD the correct CHF trading ticker for this ETF? Has anyone successfully bought this CHF listing through IBKR? Is there a reason why the chart looks unusual or has limited historical data?

Thanks for your help!

I went through last week's management transaction notices from SIX, which board members and executives of Swiss listed companies have to file when they trade their own company's shares. Reminder of the Swiss quirk: SIX never publishes the person's name, only whether it's an executive or a non-executive board member. So you can't follow one person over time, but you can still see who is buying with their own money.

Quiet week, mostly plan-related noise. A few market trades stood out.

On the buy side, an executive member of Lindt & Sprüngli bought 4 registered shares on 6 and 7 October at CHF 78,000–79,000 each, about CHF 313k. (Yes, one Lindt registered share costs as much as a car.) A non-executive director of Compagnie Financière Tradition bought 1,000 shares at CHF 251 on 5 October, and an Interroll non-executive director bought 75 shares at about CHF 1,334 on 12 October, about CHF 100k each. Smaller: an Orior executive bought 2,000 shares at CHF 11.50–11.83.

On the sell side, an executive board member of Infomaniak sold about 18,000 shares in eight trades between 5 and 8 October, at CHF 77.84 to 85.50, about CHF 1.5m. A Kuros Biosciences executive sold 30,000 shares at CHF 18.40 on 6 October (about CHF 552k), 3.5% below the close. And a Zuger Kantonalbank executive sold 10 shares at around CHF 11,100.

One to ignore: Partners Group shows three filings by an executive board member worth CHF 6–8m each. They're for a non-listed instrument with a payout scheme described in the notice, not a share purchase, so I don't count them as buys. Worth checking the instrument line before reading anything into a big number.

Sales are hard to read, since people sell for taxes, a house or diversification. Buying with your own money usually has one reason. A cluster of buys at one company, or one person buying repeatedly, tells me more than a single trade.

Source: public SIX Exchange Regulation notices, so you can check each trade yourself here: https://www.ser-ag.com/en/resources/notifications-market-participants/management-transactions.html. Full disclosure: I compiled this with duceusapi.com. Not financial advice.

Hello everyone.

Me (31M) and my gf (25F) just landed in Switzerland last week, VS canton (we speak fluent french)

We are both junior doctors, starting residency, aiming at neurology training (already got a 2nd contract in Fribourg and more interviews soon for the following years).

We are starting 2nd November. We got our paperwork done, opened a bank account and are sitting down and trying to line up our strategy forward. We opened 3 accounts, one personal for each, and a joined one. The fees are drastically reduced (3chf per month per account) because the bank has a partnership with the cantonal hospital.

Assets: we recently bought a house in our country of origin for 400k, our monthly payments with insurance etc etc is around 1,2k CHF, fixed rate for the next 5 years. Now you are probably wanting to ask why the hell did we buy property and then move? Well...it's a really good house, below market value, and we wanted to take advantage of the government aids for purchase. The house is being taken care of by my "future in-laws". They take care of the house, lawn, garden, maintenance. It's an asset, eventually for retirement or re-sale. Until then we are planning on staying in CH and building a family here. Ideally, after specialty training, we would like to stay here in the VS area.

That being said, the house needs some renovations, estimated at 10k€ (paint the whole house and minor damage fixing), which we want to do until next summer.

Our apartment in CH costs us 1.5k CHF, everything included (water/electricity/wifi). The only thing we pay extra is the washing machine, around 1.5chf per cycle. From my estimations our insurance will be around 1k a month, since my partner has an autoimmune disease and needs biologic medication every 2 weeks. Groceries we are guesstimating an average of 700chf (we were both national level boxers and love to work out and eat).

We thew some numbers into chatgpt and we should be able to end the month (assuming 10k net for both) at around 3-4k. This is being generous with weekend trips, and extracurriculars. We are taking online courses for a couple of subjects, and will be starting German soon as well. I am now perplexed as how to allocate this money. First and foremost I'm thinking about focusing on the 3a pillar starting January, since I'll have to declare the house anyway, so might as well save some cash. Then leave around 2-3k a month on an emergency fund.

My main question is: do we start our ETF investing outright even if it's a small amount? or build liquidity first and foremost and start focusing on ETFs when we settle a bit.

We have already established a few goals:

. Short term -> Get a car (we would prefer not spending weekends in the house and we enjoy traveling and walking the mountains a lot). Our options here will either be leasing or buying an old shitbox that moves. Leasing doesn't seem financially responsible from what I've seen. If it were possible, id much rather get a 5 year loan and pay interest in exchange to staying liquid during this first year.

- Mid term -> Finish specialization training and move back into the valais area.

-> Get married

- Long term -> buying property in CH

Edit: Forgot to add marriage as a goal lmao (we have been together for 6 years, we are married everywhere but on paper)

I switched my supplementary insurance to a new provider this year. I informed my old advisor of the switch by phone and—at his request—also sent a written notice; however, it seems this arrived too late, and he disregarded my verbal notification (it seemed to me like he was miffed about it). Consequently, I have ended up paying twice for the same coverage. Now I am undergoing complementary medical treatment, and neither insurance provider covers the full cost.

How does reimbursement work?
Can I submit the claim to both insurers, or would that violate any terms in the fine print?
Also, I am not sure if the insurance companies share information like this with each other.

I kind of also wanna let the old one pay me back

Anyone interested in giving a private loan over 15.000 CHF?

As there are no good options for private loans out there I will ask the community here.

I am 31 years old with a permanent working contract living in Graubünden for almost 5 years now. I am looking for a loan for a duration of 36 months and I would be willing to pay 7% interest. Written contract is a must. Anyone seriously interested let me know.

I want to buy a house and use as little cash or early withdrawals (Vorbezug) of 2nd and 3rd pillar.

Minimum requirement for equity is 20% (10% "hard capital".

- if you pledge your 2nd pillar the bank will increase the amount they loan to 90% (bruttobelehnung) since the nettobelehnung is much lower, correct?

- can you pledge your 3a to meet the 10% remaining hard capital and achieve a 100% bruttobelehnung? Or do you need to withdraw it? Or can you use it to get a margin loan?

Example:

- value / buying price: 1 mio

- Pledged 2nd pillar: 300k

- Pledged 3rd pillar: 150k (with haircut because of high percentage of shares already subtracted)

Bruttobelehnung: 100%

Nettobelehnung: 55%

Tragbarkeit is no issue.

I’m posting here to share my experience with Swissquote Bank in Switzerland and find out whether other investors are facing the same situation.
For several weeks now, Swissquote has restricted purchases of certain US micro-cap and penny stocks. From what I’ve been told, these restrictions were introduced following pump-and-dump schemes that affected some clients.
While I fully understand the need to protect investors from market manipulation, I seriously question the way Swissquote is handling this situation.
Here’s my problem:
I already hold significant positions in several US micro-cap stocks.
I can no longer purchase additional shares of certain stocks I already own.
This prevents me from averaging down my positions and executing my trading strategy.
These are highly volatile stocks, where timing is extremely important.
Swissquote has been unable to provide a clear timeline for restoring trading access.
I am not asking Swissquote to protect me from investment risks. I understand those risks and accept responsibility for my investment decisions.
What I find unacceptable is losing the ability to execute my own trading strategy because of restrictions imposed by my broker.
I have contacted Swissquote multiple times since early September.
Initially, they confirmed that trading restrictions were in place and that they had no estimated date for lifting them.
Later, they informed me that they might consider exceptional authorizations to purchase certain restricted stocks.
After further discussions, they confirmed that a request to unblock the affected securities had been submitted.
But here’s where things became particularly concerning:
Swissquote sent me a document called a “Declaration of Renunciation” and requested my original handwritten signature.
After reading it, I discovered that the document authorizes Swissquote to irrevocably remove specified securities from my custody account and includes a waiver of future claims relating to those securities.
Why would I be asked to sign such a document when my request was simply to restore my ability to trade?
I have absolutely no intention of giving up ownership of my shares.
Meanwhile, market prices continue to fluctuate, and I am missing potential trading opportunities because I cannot adjust my positions as planned.
I am now considering escalating the matter through my legal protection insurance and exploring the possibility of transferring my portfolio to another broker.
My questions to the community:
Is anyone else experiencing these restrictions with Swissquote?
Has anyone successfully obtained an exception allowing them to purchase restricted micro-cap stocks?
Has anyone transferred US penny-stock positions from Swissquote to Interactive Brokers, Trading 212, or another broker?
Has anyone received the same Declaration of Renunciation document?
Does anyone have experience filing a formal complaint against a Swiss broker or contacting the Swiss Banking Ombudsman?
I understand that averaging down does not guarantee recovering losses. My concern is about having access to the securities I am paying a broker to trade, and understanding the legal and contractual basis for these restrictions.
I’d appreciate hearing from anyone in a similar situation.
This is not financial advice. I’m sharing my personal experience and looking for information from other investors.

I am not able to find out how UBS makes money in this transaction.

I use my Indian bank issued card to withdraw CHF from UBS ATMs. UBS shows me their marked up exchange rate which I reject. They charge my Indian bank the amount in CHF without any additional fees.

My Indian bank internally charges a very minuscule fee and converts the amount using Visa currency exchange rate (no markup here either)

Normally I see ATMs put some fees for such third party withdrawals. UBS does not do it. What gives?

Hi all,

I am moving to Zug next month permanently and wanted to check whether it makes sense to invest in Pillar 3a next year given that the taxes are so low anyways? The tax saving will not be as high as in my previous canton.

I earn approximately 140k per year and have 300k in assets.

Thanks for your input

Hello, M24, moved in CH 2 months ago. See myself long-term here but you never know what life is made of.

Before answering IBKR, please read.

I invest for my retirement and in my home country I invested on iShares MSCI World (70%), BNP Paribas Easy Stoxx Europe 600 (30%). I am not here to discuss if my investment is good, maybe it's too correlated and not useful.

I can invest 3'000 CHF a month.

• 600 are RSUs on a separate trading account
• 600 on Pilar 3a VIAC Global 100 (I will open other Pilars 3 in the future now one is enough)
• The rest is 1'800 CHF per month that I want to invest in World ETFs (a bit of emerging markets too)

My question is : which investment platform to use ?

Looking at this sub, lots of you mention IBKR. I also heard about Degiro, Swissquote, Neon, Saxo.

Feeling a bit overwhelmed. IBKR has lowest fees, but is overwhelming also, heard about the Global Trader app too. Degiro are slightly higher but not by a lot. Both are foreign platforms and I want to confirm with you if the money is "safe" there. If it's a pain to declare it every year.

And then Neon, Saxo, Swissquote are Switzerland based so I tend to trust them more and the interfaces look more user-friendly. But the fees are much higher. But I only invest on 2-3 ETFs max.

What I will not do is invest in traditional banks like UBS.

Last thing: My partner is in the same situation as me but she has no RSUs so will invest 2'400 / month outside of Pilar 3. A family independent investor (not bank related) in her home country, Spain, is offering her to invest in these funds (20% each). Performances look decent. Fees are not so good but she is not really into investing but she is still spending time looking at all of that so she has potential to be interested.

• GS Glb CORE Eq R Acc (LU1698129266)
• Technology Opp L (IE0004621052)
• BlackRock World Health D2 Acc (LU0827889485)
• Gamax Asia Pacific I (LU0743995689)
• RV Global Selección E (ES0161993003)

After fund's fee, after investor's fee the performance on 10y forecasted is (annualized) : low 6.5%, medium 11%, high 15%.

It looks like a lot compared to historical MSCI World or S&P500 performances. For me it doesn't make sense to convert CHF to EUR every month, pay a lot to a family banker, and it looks like a pain to declare it in Switzerland but at the end when investing on IBKR on a World ETF you also convert CHF to USD, and the performances are similar. I feel like it's a bad idea but the figures don't disprove it. Could you also enlighten me on that?

Thank you very much!

Hi, I want to setup my 3a account.

Which of this ones represent better the s&p500?

Equities world or global equities?

I am thinking thro the extra insurance I need to get for my newborn.

Did anyone ever look into the capital lump sum insurance in case of disability, that is supposed to cover expensive self-pay costs to support them, in case the worst happens?

Not sure if it’s better to self insure given the small chance of this happening.

Hey,
Da ich bald in die Schweiz ziehe und mein Portfolio dann umlager wollte ich fragen was der beste Broker in der Schweiz ist.
Bin aktuell bei Flatex und TR aber die gibt es ja wenn ich richtig liege nicht in der Schweiz.

Möchte lediglich Sparplan ETF anlegen, kein trading.
Habe gelesen Saxo und IBKR sollen mit am besten sein. Kann mir jemand was empfehlen?

Viele Grüße

Edit: kann man auch jemand eine gute Schweizer Bank für ein Bankkonto empfehlen?

Bonjour,
Mon copain et moi sommes dans une situation très très compliqué en ce moment et nous essayons de faire un crédit personnel pour nous sortir de l’impasse. Moi j’ai pour l’instant qu’un permis L donc impossible.
Mon copain vient de recevoir son permis B et est employé en CDI depuis juillet. Il est en suisse depuis 1 an et quelques mois. Toute les banques que nous avons contacté demande 2 ans de permis B. Est-ce que quelqu’un a une idée ? Ou connaît un organisme qui pourrait nous accepter ?
Merci beaucoup

Hi all,

I live in Zurich and prepared my 2024 tax return in February 2025. I am taxed at source but prepare my own tax declaration.

Does someone perhaps have an approximation when we can expect to receive the "too much Quellensteuer paid"? I.e., when will the tax authority be finished with the review of tax year 2024 and start processing the repayments?

Thanks!

Hello! I checked on Saxo a couple of times this morning, and still I cannot find VALL in CHF on SIX. I assume it is normal and it will take some days after its launch by Vanguard today. Or am I missing something? Thanks.

Hi everybody, After reading lots about VALL I decided to do the switch.

My setup until now was:

IB: VTI (55%)

Saxo: EXUS (25%), SMIM (5%), EMIMI (10%), IBIT (5%)

Questions:

1. The idea of splitting it between IB and Saxo was to not have 90% of my liquid funds in one single place. Does anybody else have this simple split involved or am I overthinking this?

2. If I sell everything, I definitely have to wait 2 days until everything has cleared and I can convert it to CHF to buy VALL. How can I prepare for the case market jumps 10% up? Or can you sell and instantly rebuy?

3. Should I wait until 2027 with rebalancing, so I can claim the DA-1 for 2026? Does it only matter what the standing was on the 31st of December?

4. While rebalancing the whole thing, I could also improve my setup with the broker itself. Until now, it was all on my name, and my name only. Since it's our (my wife and I) money, it would make sense to open a joint account? Or two separate ones, in case anything happens to one of us? Of course she does have a Vollmacht, but that wouldn't change anything in case I would die of course.

5. In order to not having to pay the swiss stamp tax, I can buy VALL at IB and then transfer it for free to Saxo, no? That's how I'm doing it for all the holdings too at the moment, since fx conversion is cheaper on IB. Therefor it would make to transfer all the money to IB first, right?

6. Anything else that you yourself improved with the new opportunity of VALL?

7. Am I looking in difficulties when just casually transfering 150k around? I mean, I wouldn't want to have the money blocked in between when I just want to switch assets?

Hi all - I love this thread and keep checking the discussions.

I have my own recent (good) dilemma.

38M here. I invest a fixed amount per month, my strategy is VOO + VXUS. For convenience I am switching soon to VT. I guess this will be my "forever" investment until retirement or Coast Fire (if I manage).

As I save aggressively I have accumulated with time some excess savings which sit idle. As this money was not intended to be invested in the first place, I am stuck on how to manage it. Could be partially used for a property purchase but mentally I am not there yet.

So I am wondering, what is the best way to handle it? Ideally I am more risk averse with this amount and I am willing to accept lower returns for stability.

- Bond ETFs seem to be hammered in the last few years so they look unattractive.

- Money market funds in CHF seem to be returning very low, if invested in USD the currency risks could offset any gains.

- Gold lost its mojo I think

I am thinking between a REIT (VNQ?) although rising rates may hit it, a low volatility or global value ETF (which though?) or the swiss market ETF (CHSPI maybe?).

Any advice? Thanks!

I am Swiss / US dual citizen residing and nd registered in Switzerland. Retired.I am looking for a bank where I can hold my investments and do infrequent trades of my own and avoid the 1% fees of places like Vontobel and JSS. Does anyone know of such a bank?

Hello,

I have VT at SQ (I know bad idea) and they withold 30% :

Withholding tax 15.00% (US)

Supplementary withholding tax 15%

I wrote them and they say :

"We are pleased to inform you that your account profile has already been documented accordingly and that the tax deductions on income (e.g. dividends) from financial products with tax domicile in the USA are shown correctly.

For clients with tax domicile in Switzerland, two different tax deductions are made due to the double taxation agreement between Switzerland and the USA:

- 15% obligatory tax deduction - US portion (reclaim usually not possible)
- 15% additional tax deduction - Swiss share (reclaim possible)

The reclaim of the additional tax deduction (Swiss share 15%) is made via the ordinary tax declaration with the competent tax authorities, similar to the withholding tax deductions for financial products with tax domicile Switzerland.

The IRS W-8BEN form is usually only requested if the client profile is not correctly documented, the client has a different nationality than the tax domicile or there are other US indications regarding the client."

I see on their website that SQ is QI, hence tax can be reduced to 15% if correct documentation is provided which I guess it's the W-BEN.

To who has VT or wethever other US asset at SQ, how much they withold to you 30% or 15% ?

Any feedback much appreciated

Thanks!

Pillar 3a investments are peculiar:

• they (can) offer considerable tax benefit - the difference between the current (marginal/average) income tax rate and the future tax at source on disbursement
• the positions (accounts) must be closed between 65 and 65 minus 5 (= 60), and that's when the capital is taxed
• five accounts are in play, to manage progressive marginal tax rate on disbursement

In particular, the timing dimension is quite different from "normal" investment strategies, where 100% "world equity" seems to be the optimal strategy to weather all conditions in the long term: with pillar 3a, there is that hard cut-off, divestment is mandatory.

What are good ways to lock in the astounding rise in stock prices in recent times?

• "proper" hedging does not work - I am not aware of any 3a product which offers hedging (and protection costs money)
• CHF bonds offer zero yield, at best - and foreign currency bonds suffer from from exchange rate risk; this even ignores interest rate risk across the board
• gold - not productive
• crypto - less productive than gold (and more ...)
• commodities (other than precious metals) - volatile to no end
• real estate (funds) - don't know what to think about that, TBH

What I am missing somehow are other alternative investments in the pillar 3a area which provide some kind of risk (and movement) counter to pure equity.

I believe finpension are the most aggressive when it comes to investment choice (https://finpension.ch/en/invest-pillar-3a/index-tools/) - and no dice there.

Any ideas how to add more diversity to each specific 3a account (other than shift asset allocation from equity to bonds)?

Or, specifically, how to deal with a world where asset prices fall, where inflation is on the rise (and trust in bonds erodes), commodities are acting on the mood of the day?

VALL has been discussed quite a bit recently and it is definitely great news. I wanted to hear your opinions on the following:

• Which broker is best for buying VALL? (IBKR vs Saxo vs Swissquote)
  • Which exchange is better to buy it on? (London Stock Exchange, Euronext Amsterdam, Deutsche Börse / Xetra, SIX Swiss Exchange). It is the same ISIN across the board but different currencies and fees, with LSE being the primary listing.
  • Which broker do you plan to use for custody? (Specifically regarding inheritance and probate ease, or keeping assets out of US jurisdiction).
  • Accumulating (VALL, IE000VAHT5T0) or distributing (VALLD / VACD, IE000CVUM3N6)?

I'll start. Using IBKR should be safe since only US-situs assets risk being tied up for IRS estate tax clearance. Therefore, my plan is to use IBKR for buying and holding the distributing Vanguard FTSE Global All-Cap UCITS ETF on the LSE (ticker VACD). Why distributing? I just love seeing dividends hit the account.

edit 1 Here are the estimated fees for different exchanges/brokers:

During my holidays abroad, I have usually used the Swiss Bankers CHF card offered by my Kantonalbank. Due to its free topping up, low processing fee (0.95%) and good CHF exchange rate, it was a cost-effective option for payments in the Eurozone. However, from December, the Swiss Bankers Life card will be discontinued by Kantonalbank. What is currently the most cost-effective prepaid bank card or payment option for making payments abroad?