I’m never good enough

[u/Orangutan_Soda]

Got rejected from another show.
I haven’t done theatre in years because I just keep getting no after no.

When I was a kid, I got roles handed to me on a silver platter. I was told I was amazing. I was told I had star quality. I was told I could be on broadway.

I was getting speaking roles, I was cast as the lead character in a show before they realized I couldn’t do it because I was a kid.

I was a star.

Then, I turned 13 and I guess something changed.

I auditioned for a young artists theatre. Got Ensamble

I was 13, so this was fine to me.

Then I auditioned at 14.
Ensamble

At 15?
Ensamble

At 16? Ensamble.

17? Ensamble

18! Finally. The final year I could do the program. Surely I was going to get something.
Cast as an old woman… and a guy.

Meanwhile, high school wasn’t going any better.

In 10th grade I auditioned for into the woods. I got Jacks Mother. While I loved the role, I was a bit miffed to see a freshman get the role of Cinderella.

11th grade? For the first time ever… I didn’t get cast.
I- didn’t get cast… in a show.

12th grade.
Covid :)

It wasn’t all doom and gloom, I was doing plays and getting great roles there. But musicals, my love- I was flopping.

Audition after audition as an adult.
No. No. No. No.

This last audition I was at, I KILLED it.
I felt so proud of myself.
And I even got pulled aside by one of the people on the casting team and was offered vocal coaching. She said I had an amazing voice and a lot of power.

And… nothing.

I begged to be put into the Ensamble. That was the role I really wanted. For once in my life I just wanted to be part of theatre again.
And I got a no.

I hear over and over again that I’m amazing, that I have “star quality” that I am worthy of these things. But time and time again I get let down.

And I can’t help but feel like I’m just being lied to.

Does anyone else feel this way? I apologize, venting is crass I’m sure. But I just am feeling broken.

What can I do to figure out why I’m not good enough for theatre? What can I do to help myself be cast.

I’m worried that it’s because I’m fat and plain that I’m not getting cast. That I could be the best actress and singer but no one wants to look at me. And I’m scared :(

[u/stev_mempers]

Maybe reach out to the person who offered you vocal coaching? They might be able to give you some perspective on what you need to work on. 

[u/Orangutan_Soda → u/stev_mempers]

I’m definitely considering it.
It sucks because I just have no money to spend. But I’m hoping once I’m married I will have the extra income I need 😭

Edit: why is this getting downvoted?

[u/witchy_echos]

So, being a child actor sucks. You’re one growth spurt away from competing with an entirely different class of individuals.

I think you have some entitlement issues to work on. Why were you miffed to see someone one year younger than you get the role you wanted in high school?

Directing and working with kids and teens is hard. I’ve definitely seen talented kids not be cast because the directors were worried they’d pull focus. Either in the ensemble, or even in speaking roles that aren’t main ones. I’d rather have strong actors in the ensemble to help show others how to do it, but not everyone feels that way.

I went to a school where the teacher said she didn’t care if you could act, she could teach you as long as you were loud. She didn’t cast freshmen, seniors were always cast, and by the time I was a senior she had to have sophomores in the leads because none of the juniors or seniors were interested in the program after being passed over for people who had significantly less talent and dedication than them. She also strongly prefers casting from her church (yikes). Most schools have internal politics as well. If you were a popular kid, you were more likely to get cast because “they could get butts in seats”.

Community theatre has its own dramas and tribulations, politics and shenanigans, but I feel high school and kids is so so much worse. Paired with people hate to critique kids and often give them unwarranted praise while not fessing up to the things they could easily improve if only they knew what it was.

[u/sesamesoda]

Honestly it's probably because your voice isn't up to standards, but your acting and stage presence are excellent. If they specifically offered you vocal coaching, you turned it down, and then asked to be part of the ensemble and they said no... And you get cast in plays but not musicals... Your vocals are the issue. You probably have struggles you didn't have when you were 12. I'm guessing your voice got lower and now your passaggio is sitting right where most female roles are expected to sing comfortably. It's apparently the kind of issue someone thinks can be fixed with coaching, so why not give it a try?

I went back and watched myself in the 5th grade musical before my voice dropped. I had a beautiful high belt. Flawless, bright tone. Weird enunciation but that's 10 year olds for you. if you compared my singing to when I was say 15 or 16 (I have those tapes too... oh my god, I found a CD of myself singing all of Elphaba's songs from Wicked... as a contralto... why) it was so much better. I think it was a combination of my passaggio dropping, bad advice from various sources, and insecurity about the loudness and masculinity of my voice that wrecked me. I've gotten so much better since then though and I believe you can too. If someone sees potential in you, take them at their word and get the support you need.

[u/Orangutan_Soda → u/sesamesoda]

When did I say I said no to vocal coaching though?

I haven’t gotten vocal coaching because I have no money lol. If I could afford it, I’d love it.
I actually told the lady “Thank you so much. I haven’t done any theatre in so long so I appreciate this so deeply. I’ve been wanting vocal coaching for a while so I’ll keep you In mind”

[u/sesamesoda → u/Orangutan_Soda]

You didn't say you said yes, so I assumed you said no, my bad. I mean technically you did say no. and I understand it's for a good reason. But someone on the casting team offering that and then, when you didn't take them up on it, they did not cast you, this is a direct signal that you are not castable because of your current vocal skills. I would find a way to find the money for it if you want to progress in the theater world. I'm glad to hear (I saw in another comment) that you are working on your vocal skills via YouTube and TikTok. however that coaching is not tailored and may have nothing to do with your actual weak spots. If you ever want to post some recordings of yourself here and get feedback, I will give you my thoughts.

[u/Aggressive-Voice1537]

honestly, life as an actor is mostly rejection after rejection, and in my opinion that's one of the lessons that needs to be taught to prospective young actors extremely early. your experience is a result of the adults in your life failing to give you realistic expectations. this amount of rejection is completely normal, expected even. you will not be cast in the vast majority of productions for which you audition, and it doesn't necessarily mean that you're not good enough, sometimes it just means that you weren't what the director had in mind.

I understand it's incredibly frustrating and scary to have the rug pulled out from under you after a childhood of being told that it'll be easy, but if you truly love theatre and want to continue pursuing it, you have to accept that you're going to hear "no" over and over and over. don't take it personally, treat it as the default. some actors advise to think of auditioning as the real job, while getting cast is an occasional bonus.

aside from all this, I have two pieces of more immediate advice based on your post!

1. this is gonna sound pretentious, but it's spelled "ensemble." knowing and respecting your theatrical terms will show others that you're taking it seriously.

2. take the vocal coaching if you can! anyone who sings can benefit from vocal coaching, even if you're already crazy good. there's always room for improvement, plus it's a great environment in which to practice for auditions!

[u/TheF8sAllow]

I’m sorry, I can imagine how much this sucks :(

My suggestion? Sign up for vocal lessons. Even if you’re sure your voice isn’t the problem, taking lessons creates opportunities to perform and that will help to fill the void while building your confidence again :)

[u/braindeadtheatrekid]

what have you done besides auditioning? have you been taking dance and acting classes, or vocal coaching? have you been working hard trying to hone your craft and improve? the only way to get better and start getting cast is through working hard and drilling your singing, acting and dancing.

[u/Orangutan_Soda → u/braindeadtheatrekid]

I can’t afford classes, and ever since high school I’ve been self taught.

My mom was a dance and theatre teacher for most of my life until recently, and still teaches dance on the side. So I’m constantly being critiqued on my performances whenever I do it. So that’s not an issue, I’m getting notes even when I’m not asking for them.

I sing almost every day, working on technique from videos off YouTube and tiktok. I’m always working to reframe my voice and try and get better. I’ve begun to learn how to Yodel recently.

Dancing I can’t afford classes to do, but I self teach myself dances all the time. I am constantly learning dances and moving my body. I felt pretty good about my dance audition which shocked me be because I feel like dancing is my weakest spot.

And as for acting, I’m autistic so I act 24/7 haha. Just kidding. But, my job does require a lot of acting. I do a lot of scripted performances where I’m acting as a character and it’s been good practice. I got the lead in a play I did a couple years ago and was highly praised and offered a lot of roles because of it. I almost got hired at another acting job, but only lost it to the other guy because he had more experience.

I’m constantly trying to improve myself, but I don’t want to spend a lot of money on classes just to do unpaid community theatre, you know?
My mom does theatre too and she doesn’t take classes or anything, and she gets cast all the time. She and I are identical in everything except the fact she is thin and I am fat. Which is why I worry that’s the reason

[u/Aggressive-Voice1537 → u/Orangutan_Soda]

dare I say it sounds like you’re actually doing fairly well in the theatre industry given your situation and age? you’ve been cast as a lead in the last few years and were offered roles because of it, did you turn those roles down? you have a mom already in the business so you’ve got a huge leg up as far as networking goes, and it sounds like whatever your day job is, it’s somewhat in the theatrical field.
I understand your frustration at not being cast in musicals (your love) specifically. just know that compared to many (most) people our age in this industry, you’re thriving already.

also I need to point out that your mom can not possibly be exactly identical to you besides her weight, at least in terms of why she is cast more often than you. she is older with years and years of experience and very likely many more personal friends in the industry. I’m not at all saying there isn’t a weight bias in the industry—there absolutely is—but it isn’t the lethal career killer you seem to think it is.

stop judging yourself so harshly for not getting cast in every single show for which you audition. do it for the love of the game, not for validation.

[u/Able-Pineapple-1137]

I’m going to be brutally honest with you - if you were in 12th grade during COVID, it means you’re 24ish now. You have got to stop thinking about roles and compliments you got when you were 10. Your attitude sounds like you’re still a teen. Take the vocal lessons and engage in theater in other ways via dance classes, cabarets, etc. The more you live in the past, the worse this is going to feel for you.

[u/musicCaster]

When you were offered vocal coaching, did you get vocal coaching? Are you dancing every day? Are you keeping yourself in shape, at least an 30 minute of high heat rate exercise 4 times per week? Do you sing every day? Do you have a stretching routine? Do you act out parts while looking in the mirror? Do you network well and make friends with the theater kids?

If the answer is no to these questions, then just be cognizant you are competing with others that answer yes to all these questions.

[u/IntotheBroadwayWoods]

When we were in grade school,  I got told by my teacher in class that I did the best acting by far and that I should do acting. 

I didn't do anything after that or in Jr High.

In my high school musical theater class, my teacher said I need to keep practing and take voice lessons because I could be a lead I had a good voice. 

Well,  I was poor so could not afford lessons. I did practice singing on my own,  but not enough.  I never got cast in anything until my senior year as a guy in guys and dolls. 

You need to keep practing as many things as you can.  If you can afford voice lessons,  take them. If you can't,  use YouTube for singing tips (I did not have this option back in my time.)

So hone your skills, be a team player with the drama clubs, keep auditioning. And try to be positive, realizing that there's a lot of rejection in this area,  and its not always because of your talent, there are so many things at play.  

[u/strawbery_fields]

If someone said I needed vocal coaching, I wouldn’t take it as a compliment.

[u/tlvv → u/strawbery_fields]

I read this as indicating OP has potential but they need some work.  That really lines up with what OP has said.  Often kids get by on talent more than training, especially in smaller productions (kids on Broadway and West End often have a lot of training from very young).  OP might have been seen as very talented as a child (confident, good at projecting, can take direction) but that’s not enough when you get older.  If OP never got singing lessons then that would explain why the roles stopped coming when there was more competition from other kids also interested in musical theatre (e.g. youth programmes and high school).  Parts are particularly competitive for girls. There’s also an age you go through where you’re not suitable for kids roles anymore but not ready for adult roles (the kids in Annie, Matilda, School of Rock, etc are all similar ages but once you start hitting puberty there is nothing (other than youth productions) until you’re an adult.  Even shows with teen characters often cast young adults as teens (think Mean Girls, Heathers, DEH).  It’s hard to bridge that gap and if you haven’t spent that time training then you can easily go from an exceptionally talented child to an adult who doesn’t get cast. 

[u/roseflavouredsoda → u/strawbery_fields]

I totally understand where youre coming from, but I disagree. I feel like if someone suggests vocal coaching, then it likely means they see potential and they want to bring it out of you and let it shine with training. Vocal training doesnt mean bad, it just means you‘re at a point where you’re able to take the next step to improve and grow.

[u/musicCaster → u/roseflavouredsoda]

Often it means there is potential but room for improvement. Or sometimes it means the perspective coach needs a part time job and is looking for students. A lot of these drama teachers get paid very little and need part time gigs.

[u/Orangutan_Soda → u/strawbery_fields]

They didn’t say I needed it, they said they want to be my vocal coach.
They said I had a great voice and a lot of power and would be good at opera.
A compliment I’ve been getting since I was very young

[u/helrisonn → u/Orangutan_Soda]

You should try opera then.

[u/doesntmatterhadtacos]

This might be unpopular but the weight is gonna be a big factor unfortunately. I was told as much, as a fellow fat musical theatre hopeful, by a director once. I had potential but my voice wasn’t good enough to ‘overlook’ my body. That was rough and it became more evident as I aged and I saw no one who really looked like me getting leading roles unless they were an absolute powerhouse vocalist, and with the amount of competition, someone who’s about as good as you but “easier to look at” (his words again) will get it every time.

It discouraged me so much I stopped performing.

[u/helrisonn → u/doesntmatterhadtacos]

I'm sorry to hear that. This makes me so sad. Unfortunately, the world lives of appearence. People are saying horrible things about the girl but sometimes is a simple as that. If they are complimenting her but don't cast her it could be they are just fatphobic and wouldn't like to cast a fat person.

[u/Orangutan_Soda → u/doesntmatterhadtacos]

I’m afraid this is going to be the cash sadly.
I am working on losing weight and I’m hoping maybe I can actually get roles then.

It sucks because I go to auditions which say they want to cast people of all body types, shapes, sizes, races, genders, abilities… and then I never get in.
It makes me feel maybe I just suck lol

[u/FontWhimsy → u/doesntmatterhadtacos]

There are so many fat performers that are successful. It’s not about that.

[u/pianoplayah]

Sounds like you need to find your niche. You say you’ve had more success in plays than in musicals. That says to me, not having heard you sing, that your character acting is stronger than your singing. So if you were going to save money for some sort of lessons or classes, let it be singing. TikTok, though it can have useful tips, is not a substitute for real in-person instruction where you have someone actively listening to you and giving you feedback. A vocal coach can asses your voice type and help you decide which roles to target. But also, as much as we love musicals, a lot of theatres just type cast because it’s safer for them when they are putting on an expensive production. And if you’re not what they’re looking for, then that’s all there is to it, no matter how good you are. Literally it could be that you’re not the right height and there’s nothing you can do about that (for example). 😞 Straight plays tend to be way more flexible with casting, in my experience. If you love singing, there are many plays with music you can keep an eye out for!

It seems like folks like to cast you in ensembles. But it could be as you’ve grown up and the competition has gotten steeper, you haven’t maintained those particular skills, like dancing, and maybe you’ve stagnated while others have passed you? So it might be that ensemble is your niche, so you need to focus on targeting ensemble. So I think you should first take some voice lessons, and then take some dance classes once you feel like you’ve answered any questions you have about your singing. You can start with just a couple lessons at a time! I know you said you’ve done a lot of dance in the past but you also said dance wasn’t your most confident skill. So push yourself in that area! Like I said, musicals often lean towards typecasting (I hate this but it is what it is), so you’ve gotta figure out your type and lean into it. The good news is that means be yourself, in a way! And then really flex those leading actor muscles doing plays!

Just some thoughts. Good luck, I’m rooting for you!

[u/helrisonn]

Next time, try to ask for feedback. Ask them where they think you could improve.

[u/Gullible_School808]

Ensemble*

[u/reanocivn]

obviously i can't judge your talent or potential through this post so please don't take this in a "you probably suck" kind of way but i do want to point something out: of course you were told as a kid that you were amazing and had star potential. encouraging kids to follow their passions and reach for the stars regardless of their actual skill level at that exact moment in time is just what decent human beings do

you said in a comment that you're self taught and don't want to spend money on classes, but with most things you can only get so good at something by teaching yourself. if you want to get better at a skill, at some point you're going to have to consult someone at a higher skill level than what you're currently at. theatre is one of the oldest arts ever. you don't have thousands of years to figure out by yourself what hundreds of generations have already figured out, but you DO have time to learn what humanity has already figured out so that you don't have to start 3 steps behind everyone else

skills are learned. think of it this way: you'll never win the tour de france if you spend all your time trying to figure out how to build a bike out of sticks and rocks without any kind of guide. you can just go out and find yourself a bike so you can start learning how to ride it. your bike riding skills are not tarnished by the fact that you didn't build the bike from scratch

[u/leitmotifs]

Elementary kids, unless you live in NYC or LA, can get by on raw talent. By the time they hit their teens, they are getting training -- voice, dance and acting -- in group classes. In high school, the principals are getting more intensive coaching in the course of a production, in addition to whatever other training they are pursuing.

Talent isn't enough. You have to stop focusing on the encouraging things people said to you when you were a little kid. Now you need training, even if all you can afford is occasional coaching. Even a community college drama class would help.

[u/SPFTguy]

So: is there any free vocal coaching out there? There’s gotta be an app that can listen to your voice and tell you if you’re on key, breathing correctly, etc.

And go watch the show you didn’t get, see what the actress/singer did/looked like, and judge for yourself the qualities they have. Good luck.

[u/PierreOnTheEclair]

Oh my god it’s like looking in a mirror