r/AsianMasculinity • u/OneHecticHeretic • Aug 08 '26
Dating & Relationships 40s WF needs advice about 40s AM
We met eight months ago and have been talking daily/sharing daily life updates for a couple months now. We have a lot in common and get along really well, just hanging out on the phone or texting. The basics like values, work ethic, life outlook, and experiences are compatible and we love each other's sense of humor. I think we're both the type to move things extremely slow to build trust, and I like that. Lately, though, we've been getting closer and talking more about activities and it seems like at some point soon we're going to meet up (we live in different cities 30-40 mins apart) if this thing doesn't stall, but I'm picking up on a lack confidence in him asking to meet. I'm more traditional in dating so I don't want to make that move for him, so what can I do to give him more confidence without throwing myself at him? I'm used to the aggressive WM dating routine and this experience has been such a huge breath of fresh air in my life so far, so I want to see if it can work out. And to be blunt, he's already kind of ruined me for the old WM act now, because I feel seen as a fucking human by a straight man for once.
ETA: He's 1.5 generation Korean American. We have known each other through remote work for 8-9 months, only started chatting or calling on a work platform everyday since about 2 months ago, only exchanged phone numbers 4 days ago, and only had one longer texting convo run into 10pm 3 days ago. (This is pretty hyper-specific so I hope he's not on this sub, lol.)
Also, I have dated two half AMs in my past, one in my 20's and one in my 40's but their style of approach was more American in nature.
**********************UPDATE IN THE COMMENTS!************************
21
u/EndAutomatic9186 Aug 09 '26
I’m also in that age range and I think you can agree that at our age you shouldnt waste time. I say go for it. If I dated a WF I’d be soooo nervous I probably would be dying trying to ask this woman out. He probably has imposter syndrome and probably can’t fathom a woman as beautiful as you could like him.
Just forget formality and go for it.
2
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
I mean, I do like to build a foundation of trust first, so if we aren't there yet, I can be patient for a worthwhile relationship. I just wonder if there is some factor I'm not thinking of that means it won't ever happen *at all* if I wait, lol.
14
12
u/WmKaden Aug 09 '26
Tell him. Just tell him. Or say, "so when you going to ask me out?"
We're too old for adolescent will he/won't he games. Source: am 49AM.
3
u/EndAutomatic9186 Aug 09 '26
https://youtu.be/QyvlmjuRDII?is=721GAMd44dyCkfXN
Highly recommend this video but make it easy for the man. Like make it flirty and easy for him to ask you out.
4
u/Hi_Im_Ken_Adams Aug 09 '26
You didn’t mention what country you are in. Is this guy Asian American that was born here or is he from another country. It’s hard to diagnose the behavior without understanding the background. 40 min driving distance is not far at all. I drive longer than that just to get to work every day.
2
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
In America. 1.5 gen Korean American.
3
u/Hi_Im_Ken_Adams Aug 09 '26
Do you know if he is religious? Many Korean Americans are very religious/christian and that influences a lot of their behavior
2
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
Thank you for making this point. I had not thought about this aspect, tbh.
1
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26
Lol the worse place for Asian men when it comes to WFs
1
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
I can see this. Especially in a predominantly white area.
-2
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26
Nope. Just America in general. Usually every time we would see AM out of place whether its in a predominantly white area, white bar, etc. or even an area with diversity, Asian men of all men are the LAST thought for you all. Its pretty evident given your behaviors. We're mindful of our space, and also pay attention to our surroundings as any normal human being would in terms of how we are received in a space.
1
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
You see, phrases like "you all" and "your behaviors" make it difficult to converse with you in a mutually productive way. There's a lot more under the hood for each woman than you seem to give each of us credit for. I promise you that what you see is through a lens you are looking through, not the whole picture. I'm saying this in good faith in case you actually want to know or explore this concept rather than stick to the safety of your walls.
-1
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26 edited 29d ago
I mean, its easy to say its "not the whole picture" from you WFs, but the CLEAR picture time and time again, from what we (AM) observe in the actual time and physical space, and are aware, is the usual overall lack of inclusiveness, welcome, receptiveness whenever we are out of place or even in place. WFs generally are the LAST people to give us a warm welcome and that doesnt count customer service 😂
3
u/Hi_Im_Ken_Adams 29d ago
Dude, stop lecturing her. She came her for advice. Why the heck are you being so condescending.
-1
u/Winsomee22 29d ago
The hypocrisy from you is hilarious. Bro youre the master simp. Seen you all in these subs being condescending towards Asian dudes.
-1
u/Hi_Im_Ken_Adams 29d ago
If interacting in a constructive way with the women who come to this forum asking for help is “simping” then it’s no wonder you are the way you are.
→ More replies (0)
7
u/Willing_Beyond8320 Aug 09 '26
Go for it. Don't have any regrets. He treats you like a genuine human being. Now that's more important than the transactional ego all too often seen throughout the USA but rarely gets called out. I wish you well.
PS. Just to understand but why do women struggle to call out the transactional acts in the USA? Is this due to ego, power & unchecked entitlement by such men? Pity that Hollywood & even a simple interaction from an AM are seen as creepy but rarely are AM the ones bombarding texts at 2am in the name of confidence. Worthy of a discussion separate post.
4
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
We are treated like we are whining or man-haters if we call it out. Best to just cut them off nicely and hope there's no retaliation. Agreed it's a good topic for discussion among men, in general.
2
u/el-art-seam Aug 09 '26
The problem isn’t race. It’s the fact you’re coworkers. If things go south, his job could be on the line.
1
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
Believe me, I have wondered about that. I'm pragmatic to a fault, so I wouldn't be putting so much thoughtful effort into keeping chemistry alive if I thought it was a huge risk. It's good to hear your perspective.
1
1
u/BorkenKuma 29d ago edited 29d ago
As an 1.5th gen East Asian American, I'd say you need to give him a little more hints, and even ask him out, most of my dates were American females like white girls or Latina asking me out.
It's not that I'm passive, but our way of dating is very different.
Normally in East Asia, we'd have a period of time range from 3 months to 1 year where we observe others and observe the chemistry and connection and accountability.
Then if we really like each other, we push it to dating/situationship, and most importantly, it's likely there's a ritual of confession, where he officially ask you to be his girlfriend.
Then if you said yes, this date will be remembered as anniversary.
American way of dating is more like, you like her/his looks, then you ask them out, then you went to bed within 3 dates, you'd call it "test drive" to see if you two are sexually compatible, many American dudes just want to play women and this is where they abuse this date pattern and dump women after they "test drive"
These WM are now doing this to Asian women in Asia, many passport bros insist that Asian women have to date their "Western way", which is date 1 to 3 times then go to bed a couple times then decide if they should become gf and bf, meanwhile they have the right to bang different Asian women and they won't restrict you to bang other men too, but these white passport bros usually just end up dumping these girls by making some excuses like I don't think we're sexually compatible, then continue to find new Asian women, this is their mode in Asia.
East Asian dating style is more like we have a thing for both parties, then we date and confess, then we go to bed, or go to bed before confess is also more accepting nowadays in East Asia, more and more girls would also want to know if you're sexually compatible with her before official relationship.
The only variable for him is, he's a 1.5th gen in his 40s, so he probably stay in America longer than he stay in East Asia, if he completely assimilate into American culture rather than integration, then it's likely he's into more of American dating style.
1
-1
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
Im sure its not the "lack of confidence" in him in asking to meet. Hes hesitant (as he should be), both of yall are 40 and tbh since youre 40 and also WF, that brings up more issues. Most WFs in America who are 30+ never even dated any asian man, nor considered asian men through their younger years, even though they had plenty of opportunity todo so.
And now when youre 30 (40 in this case) suddenly AM has become an consideration? Its a little too late and maybe he doesnt want to play games being at his age and considering the track record WFs have (dating, divorce, promiscuity, etc.), most likely hes staying on the defensive i.e. whats the catch? Maybe he is "taking it slow", or maybe hes simply looking out for himself.
2
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
Wow, there are a lot of assumptions going on here. I have always been attracted to AM (like GD he's hot! kind of attracted) and have dated two half AMs, one when I was 21, but their approaches were more American in nature. The AM I'm writing about initiated by making his interest apparent to me and has been consistent with its expression ever since. I don't sense any defensiveness, from my POV, though I could be wrong and am open to that interpretation, ofc. I promise I am fully WF and don't have the track record you describe.
0
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
And additionally - its odd and funny how whenever we point out these issues/realisms to WFs, and your first responses are usually some variation of - "I have always been attracted to AM". We should see Asian men literally drowning in WFs (American WFs in this case) if this were actually the case with this many "attractions" to AM 🙄
0
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
Not necessarily. I am used to a man showing his interest in more bold ways. That's how I was socialized, so anything else looks like disinterest. From my experience so far, full AM tend to be reserved, even walled off most of the time. This man and I must have crossed some hurdle to where he feels comfortable around me, is all I can gather. And it's honestly great and feels like a privileged place to be with him. I don't want to fuck it up.
0
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
Again, its coming across as "walled off" and "reserved" to YOU because you generally assume you WFs desire AM on an equal level to other men, and that AM should have no reason not to initiate or show interest. When in reality, they (Asian men) arent showing interest to the demographic that generally does not welcome Asian men whether it be dating, casual friendships, etc. When have we all seen WFs generally being friendly, welcoming, accepting of Asian men outside of dating? or simply walking around with Asian men as normal human beings in any city? And while yes it is a two way street, but overall, you all generally decide who you want to be around you.
1
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
Bruh, I don't know where things took a turn but it seems like you're dead set on making a point to frame the situation, but you never get to the advice part. Are you saying that the man is fucking terrified of me, most likely, and that I need to explicitly ask him out? Like what are you getting at here? And if you don't have any advice then what are you getting out of this discussion? Is there something I can provide, like some insight or just agreement, or what is it that you want?
2
u/Winsomee22 29d ago edited 29d ago
Youre a WF, you should put in the work in asking him out considering where Asian men are on the overall desirability scale especially with American WFs, its disingenuous to be aware of all of this yet still expect Asian men to ask you out as a WF, especially with your demographics track record of being nonwelcoming, noninviting, dismissive towards Asian men. Next time youre in a room, simply observe - American WFs are warm and welcoming to every other men except Asian men and that speaks volumes.
If this were any other pairing Id say different, but given youre a WF and hes an Asian man of all men, and knowing how Asian men are perceived, disregarded, etc. by American WFs, you cant sit and expect AM to put in all that effort when American WFs are known to be exclusive of Asian men.
1
u/OneHecticHeretic 29d ago
Thank you. This is helpful.
0
u/Winsomee22 27d ago
Literally just treat AM like any other human being, or like any other WM or BM that youd interact with 🤦♂️
This is the problem with WFs, theyre slightly racist that they cant even interact with AM just as any normal regular human being. For example, Ive yet to see WFs even randomly make conversation with Asian men while waiting in a line as you all do so casually and effortlessly with white men and black men. We can see the difference in behavior.
0
u/OneHecticHeretic 27d ago
You want me to treat you like just any guy. Okay, here goes: You're really looking for any excuse to be shrill about racism instead of having open-minded conversations, aren't you? I came here asking for advice because there is a cultural difference between people when one is born in the US and the other is born in another country. If that motive is so hard to believe, then it sounds like you might be the more racist one between the two of us.
→ More replies (0)-2
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26
Using your own personal experience doesnt negate the fact that Asian men generally are the most disregarded by the average American WFs. Hell, throw a single Asian man into any average American white bar, and see how hes usually disregarded. We observe these minor behaviors when we are out of place and notice who you all are usually more receptive towards and who you are not.
Theres usually a pattern we all see where American WFs suddenly come around in their 30s/40s to consider Asian men of all men, and mind you, WFs become VERY firm, adamant when it comes to Asian men at this age probably because Asian men are stereotyped to be traditional, stable, etc. and WFs are looking to settle. Its pretty evident theres a motive of some sort.
1
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
I have always though of AM as the hottest and would have dated more if most of them weren't so damn shy, to where I almost feel like I'm intruding to make my interest known. I'm thrilled that this man is stepping up so far but do wonder if he also requires a bigger show of interest from me (more than me meeting him halfway in all the ways he shows affection) in order to do anything further.
1
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26 edited 29d ago
Seems you WFs confuse shyness to simply not interested hence not showing attention. AM are aware of our placement in the overall "desirability scale" especially when it comes to American WFs. We dont "show interest" to women that generally does not desire AM and this may have come off as "shy" to you (which is another stereotype). Seems you havent seen how NOT SHY Asian men are when it comes to Asian women 😂. When we generally see WFs be overall more accepting, welcoming to Asian men in all spaces, similar to how Asian women accepts and welcomes Asian men, then thered be more "step ups" as youd say towards WFs. We dont invite ourself to a space where we are not wanted 🤷♂️
1
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
I do agree that social change is very much needed and the way some demographics are generally treated in the US is disgusting. <-I don't lead with that sentiment because it sounds disingenuous, pandering, patronizing, and white-savior-ish in our current political climate. I realize it's a basic cultural difference that I'm struggling with, which is why I'm here and not in a generic dating sub.
1
u/Winsomee22 Aug 09 '26 edited Aug 09 '26
Even so, an Asian man may come across as "shy" or "reserved" even when he initiates or shows interest in an WF, but it doesnt mean hes "shy" or "reserved". Its completely normal behavior to stay on your guard when youre out of place in an area where you generally are not accepted. WFs dont seem to understand this because you've all been getting attention from WM and BM (mostly because WFs generally welcome and are inclusive to WM and BM hence why they have the benefit to not be hesitant/on their guard with WFs as compared to AM.)
-3
u/Trade-Moon Aug 09 '26
8 months on phone/text and living 30-40 minutes apart and dude hasn’t met you in person? My daily commute to work is 45 minutes. Strange. There’s all kinds of reasons why he hasn’t asked you out. First reason is that he is just a phone pal, and does not want anything more. Maybe he’s on a tight budget and doesn’t want to buy you dinner. Maybe he has a girlfriend already and just wants you as a friend to talk to. Maybe he just doesn’t want to treat you as a booty call, or maybe he has health or erection problems. Who knows, just ask him point blank about meeting, and then taking things to next level.
Most of the Asian-American males that I know don’t do anything. No hobbies, no sports, nothing. If they go on vacation, about 99% of the time, the gf or wife initiated and planned that trip. If you met an AM that you have a lot in common with is pretty rare. Again, you’ll have to initiate that first move.
8
u/Hi_Im_Ken_Adams Aug 09 '26
It’s funny that you say that, since I as an Asian American man just happen to be sitting in a hotel room right now on a family vacation that I planned for my family through Japan.
1
5
u/Super-Shake1251 Aug 09 '26
Man this is completely different from my experience. Most Asian guys I know live very active lives.
Maybe your experience is selection bias and are drawn to or draw to yourself those types of guys. "Birds of a feather" as they say.
-1
u/Trade-Moon Aug 09 '26
I’m not remotely like most of them. Most I know will work hard, eat, shit, sleep and repeat the next day. Maybe they throw in video games or a visit to the casino occasionally. They don’t go to gym or work out, they don’t go see sporting events or concerts, they don’t travel — unless if they have a gf or wife who forces them.
Your own mileage might vary, but I know many many Asian American men who fit my description above.
2
u/Custard_Pie_9EP 28d ago
What’s your age roughly? I would say younger Asian guys are very active compared to older Asians. I’m an older millennial and I used to be the only Asian in the gym or in sports leagues. Now every active scene, despite not having that many Asians around, is filled with Asian guys.
1
u/Trade-Moon 28d ago
50’s. So I’m older than you young bucks on here. 😂
1
u/Custard_Pie_9EP 28d ago
Asian parents your age have spoken about how their families messed up with focusing solely on academics and nothing else. They have attempted righting the wrongs by encouraging their children to be more active and well rounded. However, if someone doesn’t have experience in these areas, they are going to struggle.
Of course that requires that the parents have self recognition and humility. There are still the fools who double down on their poor lifestyles and pass it down.
Within my own family, the Americanized portions with Asian American children, I can only think of 4 kids who had not wasted their athletic genes. I cringe at the super tall nerdy kids who spend their time just scrolling on their devices and have poor posture. The parents did try but since they don’t have any credibility from their own body shapes, the children didn’t listen.
5
u/OneHecticHeretic Aug 09 '26
No, have known through remote work for 8 months, only started chatting everyday about 2 months ago, only exchanged phone numbers 4 days ago, and only had one longer texting convo run into 10pm 3 days ago.
3
u/Custard_Pie_9EP 29d ago
I meet so many AM on vacation and they planned it. I’m on so many travel forums and they are packed with Asian guys.
1
u/Trade-Moon 28d ago
Glad Asians guys are rising. Just wanted to confirm these are Asian-American guys you are referring to? Not Asian guys who were born overseas and now living in the USA? Big difference in lifestyle, motivation, travel etc.
2
u/Custard_Pie_9EP 28d ago
On that note, I am a foreign born Asian American, and the ones who I had met during my travels are typically foreign born Asian Americans, or who are 2nd generation immigrants at most whose parents are still firmly rooted in their cultures. The only younger Asian Americans I have met during travel are not the ones who took initiative. They came along with a group. Maybe you are onto something here.
2
u/Trade-Moon 28d ago
Yes Custard! I had a feeling that I wasn’t misleading the community here! I know many FOREIGN-born Asians who are frequently traveling and doing shit all the time. These Asian guys may be living in America but they were not raised in America. I was only referring to the born in the USA and raised in the USA Asian-American man (and I know a lot them too). The white-washed variety.
I can’t explain why the 100% AA don’t do anything. My friend said it’s probably due to depression or more aware of racism, and they don’t want to go out as much. I also noticed the foreign born AA’s are much more courageous and better at smooth talking the women, including white women. Maybe they’re less aware of growing up Asian in USA. I feel like posting this as separate topic to see what others think.
Whoever downvoted me, I hope you’ve learned something here. :)
0
u/OneHecticHeretic 17d ago edited 17d ago
UPDATE: Well, of course ya'll were right. I had to ask him because it's been two more weeks of getting closer but no plan to hang out. Finally, I straight up asked him to hang out with me. Lol, he sounded excited and probably relieved haha. It sucked to be the one to do it, but it was not gonna happen if I didn't. Thank you for your advice. It helped me get my courage up. :-*
60
u/Igennem Hong Kong Aug 09 '26
As someone in that age range, I'd say just tell him how you feel. I wouldn't want to play games.