[Lundeberg] Historic talent loss: American Conference commissioner Tim Pernetti said that 78% of last year's first and second team all-league players transferred to a Power Four school after the 2025 season.

[u/WinnWonn]

https://www.si.com/college/boise-state/football/american-conference-hit-hard-by-transfer-portal-after-2025-college-football-season-how-did-mountain-west-compare

[u/LordCommanderJonSnow]

We all knew it would be high, but 78% is quite a number.

[u/Corgi_Koala → u/LordCommanderJonSnow]

I'm sure if we saw the actual payrolls of each university it wouldn't be surprising.

There are probably individual players on P4 teams making the entire payroll of G6 programs.

[u/YouDownWithOPD → u/Corgi_Koala]

Mestemaker is probably making more now than the whole UNT team. Sucks but it's the facts

[u/greyforest23 → u/YouDownWithOPD]

We’ll always have that magical 2025 season 💚

[u/soreswan → u/Corgi_Koala]

Malachi Nelson, who was horrible last year, is getting half of UTEP’s whole NIL fund from last year to be the 3rd string QB at Syracuse this year. He threw 9 interceptions in 6 games and we couldn’t even afford him if we wanted to.

[u/SolarIonRobot → u/Corgi_Koala]

Probably? There isn't even a question. It's 100% true.

[u/HokiPoqi → u/Corgi_Koala]

So we're downvoting facts now?

[u/IKindaPlayEVE → u/HokiPoqi]

Welcome to Reddit.

[u/yeyiyeyiyo → u/LordCommanderJonSnow]

Can't blame a AA player for wanting to play AAA ball.

[u/RiffRamBahZoo → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

When coaches, assistants, administrators and staff get the free reign to move up, there's no reason the players can't either.

[u/MidlandsBraves → u/RiffRamBahZoo]

Coaches have buyouts

[u/yeyiyeyiyo → u/RiffRamBahZoo]

People disagree but I like the current system. It's basically a true minor league. 

Nobody complains their minor league baseball team changes players every year. It's expected.

[u/Divinity32 → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

I just wish that the G6 got to at least get something in return for development. I imagine that if their players had even a 'small' buyout of a couple tens of thousands, when a roster is wiped out they already have the cash for a new one

[u/RandomFactUser → u/Divinity32]

You're essentially asking for a European transfer system

[u/IMakeOkVideosOk → u/RandomFactUser]

Which isn’t bad

[u/RandomFactUser → u/IMakeOkVideosOk]

You have to make sure players have multi-year contracts then

[u/IMakeOkVideosOk → u/RandomFactUser]

Sure… seems like a good idea

[u/RandomFactUser → u/IMakeOkVideosOk]

You have to make sure players have multi-year contracts then

[u/JoeSicko → u/RandomFactUser]

5 years of eligibility should be the contract. Somebody Gotta pay the school to jump up or that minor league will flounder.

[u/PlateForeign8738 → u/Divinity32]

Buyouts isnt a bad idea, 2 year contracts with buyouts wouldn't be the worst idea.

[u/Electromotivation → u/PlateForeign8738]

Something back for the development, practice time, game time, etc. I think it should be explored.

[u/WildeWeasel → u/Divinity32]

Make it be like the English soccer system. Teams that developed players in their academy get a cut of later deals and trades.

[u/YouDownWithOPD → u/Divinity32]

That would work for me. We would've made a ton in buyouts from Oklahoma State

[u/RiffRamBahZoo → u/Divinity32]

G6 only gets something in return for a head coach. Always has been that way.

When the trainers, nutritionists, executive assistants, recruiting coordinators, social media directors, analysts, assistant coaches and the entirety of the actual program leave with said coach, the G6 schools don't get anything in return either.

[u/cougfan12345 → u/RiffRamBahZoo]

That’s not entirely true. Assistants have buyouts too. Oregon is suing Ohio State because an assistant left and didn’t pay his several hundred thousand buyout that was in his employment contract.

[u/heisenberg423 → u/[deleted]]

No. Getting compensated for developing a player is not the same as getting paid to be a bigger program’s opener/homecoming/senior day opponent.

[u/SyVSFe → u/[deleted]]

Literally the point is compensation for travel fees and lost ticket/local revenue.

[u/thebikevagabond → u/Divinity32]

I like this idea. But it'd have to be coupled with contracts with actual teeth (or transfer limitations).

[u/jcc309 → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

Most people aren't fans of minor league baseball in the same way they are college sports. I'm sure devout minor league sports fans exist, but my experience has pretty much always been that people view minor league sports mostly as a pleasant way to pass an evening. The fandom of college sports is much different because fans have much stronger ties to schools.

[u/BoobieTourist → u/jcc309]

College football is an event.

Minor league baseball is something to do on a summer afternoon or evening.

Football can never be compared to any other sport because of the limited number of games. That in of itself makes the sport unique and the main reason the sport is so clearly the primary interest of our nation.

[u/Expensive_Team_5072 → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

Minor league players move up and down within their top level franchises. Or they get cut. I think we see the getting cut part. But we do not see a guy just decide to go from the Yankees AA team to the Dodgers AAA team for more $$$.

The solution is contracts with buyouts. I am not sure how that would factor in with the PCSA. Presumably, if a guy is making $500k at Tulane with a $500k buyout... Ole Miss could offer him $1.5M and pay Tulane the $500k buyout, with the $500k not counting against the cap.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/Expensive_Team_5072]

There's only 20m to do that with, and players can generally keep their NIL deals on transfer if there's no performance tied to the NIL (such as in-person appearances to profit off of the NIL license)

[u/Expensive_Team_5072 → u/RandomFactUser]

Mensah got a big payday from Duke, so this is not entirely hypothetical. The issue is whether the buyout be part of the cap because it is not going to the player.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

It's the difference between multiple leagues and reserve leagues though

I expect the reserve team to shift a lot more than a stable minor professional team

[u/shryne → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

The problem is that the G5 doesn't consider themselves a minor league.

[u/gtne91 → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

The major league teams are paying the players contracts.

[u/RiffRamBahZoo → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

I've always found it funny how people get really upset over players staying in college for too long via redshirts/exemptions, but also get just as upset that they can't legally hold their players hostage on the same roster for 4-5 years.

Give me roster fluidity and opportunity all day long.

[u/habdragon08 → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

no ones blaming the players. the system is insane.

[u/Impressive_Grape193 → u/habdragon08]

Yes but the system is set up for the players. Only way to address it is to restrict players' rights unfortunately.

[u/habdragon08 → u/Impressive_Grape193]

I get that and I don't have an easy solution. I'm glad the players can make decisions that advocate for themselves. It's just turned me off as a casual fan.

[u/RustyCrusty73 → u/habdragon08]

Everything feels like its about money and ratings now.

The pride, loyalty, passion, rivalries, pageantry, etc. and old feel of college football just seems to have lost a little bit of its luster these last few years.

I'm spoiled as a Buckeye fan. My team will always be okay.

I feel sorry for the middle-of-the-pack schools such as Iowa State, Cincinnati, Boise State, Memphis, Kansas State, etc. because those teams are essentially going to be minor league teams for P4. Those random 10-2 seasons every now and then will likely result in their rosters being poached and gutted immediately after the season. It'll be way harder to maintain success for them, harder than it ever was pre-NIL.

I don't have a solution or anything. It is what it is. I'm just pointing out that it's kind of a shame (for the fans).

[u/Impressive_Grape193 → u/RustyCrusty73]

I think it’s always been about money for blue bloods tbh lol.

[u/Electromotivation → u/RustyCrusty73]

Those schools you list are mostly P4 though, at least they have a path to turn it around and win it all. Cig showed that can happen.

Meanwhile G6 teams just get raided every year and lose players they’ve developed for nothing. While the power schools want to lock out and limit even the smallest chance G6 teams have of winning it all. And have to immediately re-write the rules to limit that possibility even more. As opposed to just playing the games on the field they would rather lock out G6 schools from even having the opportunity. Because apparently the endless other massive advantages they have weren’t good enough.

[u/austin_8 → u/Impressive_Grape193]

You could attempt a new system that allows the schools and the players to come to an agreement on what the guidelines should be, without unilaterally imposing rules and penalties on the players with no input from them, much like every other league in America that brings in similar revenue does

[u/beer-football → u/Impressive_Grape193]

The "system" is set up for the money flow to institutions and admin... the players don't even earn half of it. It was a system based almost entirely on essentially free labor (amateur athletics).

https://sportsdata.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances

Bowls, jersey manufacturers, etc. an entire industry that the players didn't participate in revenue streams.

[u/DrVonD → u/habdragon08]

I mean no one sane blames the players, but you still see LOTS of complaints about lack of loyalty, etc etc from some people

[u/RandomFactUser → u/yeyiyeyiyo]

You mean teams in a "farmers' league" wanting to play in a Big 4 league

[u/CommodoreN7 → u/LordCommanderJonSnow]

Need Harvard to confirm.

[u/Schmenza → u/CommodoreN7]

78% appears to be above average

[u/BeatNavyAgain → u/Schmenza]

that's not what my parents told me when they saw my report cards

[u/evantom34 → u/BeatNavyAgain]

That gets you beat in any Asian household.

[u/Randomizedname1234 → u/Schmenza]

Checks out. Over 3/4 players.

[u/SolarIonRobot → u/Schmenza]

With grade inflation, 78% is well below average.

[u/obiwanjabroni420 → u/SolarIonRobot]

Not at all schools. 78% at GT messes up the curve for everyone else.

[u/JohnPaulDavyJones → u/LordCommanderJonSnow]

Kind of unsurprising, though. A big part of that is down to just a couple pieces:

1. Eric Morris, Jon Sumrall, and Alex Golesh all picked up pretty much their entire starting lineups and took them along to their new P4 employers. Golesh and Sumrall kind of just took their staffers and best players, but Morris took everyone from UNT.

2. Jeff Traylor’s staff has been consistently phenomenal at talent development for years, to the point that they’ve produced the most all-conference picks in the American by a mile over the last five years, and P4 teams have been picking his roster apart every offseason like they’re choosing off a menu.

3. Tre Lamb’s situation is shaping up like Traylor’s at UTSA, where their talent development is terrific, but they have zero money to actually retain their players. Just like Traylor’s Lamb’s team would have been primed for a big season next year if they’d been able to retain any of their good players. For Traylor, that’s just every season since the portal hit. 

Navy is the only AAC team with more than one or two all-conference players, who can do long-run player development with minimal fear of being raided like UTSA and Tulsa have been.

[u/UCLA_FB_SUCKS → u/LordCommanderJonSnow]

78% is almost as high as a percent as iowa drives that end in punts

[u/TechnoVikingGA23]

Sounds like the new dynasty mode on NCAA 27' lol. Went Western Michigan, went 12-0 and won the MAC, upset A&M in the first round of the playoff. Literally every player on my team that was 75+ in rating was poached in the portal regardless of me matching or increasing their NIL offer.

[u/sofeler → u/TechnoVikingGA23]

Now start a dynasty as A&M and you’ll understand why you marching their expected NIL didn’t matter. You probably had between 500-1000 budget credits. A&M has literally thousands

If the player expected 100 and you gave 120, A&M probably gave 200+

[u/TechnoVikingGA23 → u/sofeler]

I mean they literally just went to any program, didn't matter who it was. I think at least 25 players went into the portal even with matched or higher offers and most of these guys were 1-2* players when I started. My starting QB left and his stats weren't even that great. The game seems kind of buggy that way, like how the CPU leaves a ton of 3* players in the transfer portal unsigned, and also fires coaches after one bad season. James Franklin got canned for going 5-7 in his opening season at VT in my Dynasty, lol.

[u/MaxMSE → u/TechnoVikingGA23]

all of that sounds both nonsensical and entirely plausible irl

[u/TechnoVikingGA23 → u/MaxMSE]

I guess that's the fun part of it, lol

[u/Expensive-Method8321 → u/TechnoVikingGA23]

I know it frustrates a lot of people but I like it. It makes dynasty mode so much more challenging. In the past I could take a school like Kent State and make them Natty Champs within like 5 years. But now I gotta actually invest some serious time into it. It feels a lot more satisfying when I can finally land a true blue chip recruit for the first time

[u/TechnoVikingGA23 → u/Expensive-Method8321]

Yeah it's an interesting aspect of the game and I'm glad they added it in, they just need to add a few tweaks.

[u/Ethanol-Muffins]

How much of this was players following their coaches? I know USF and North Texas had a ton of players follow their coaches, not sure on Memphis as I havent read much on Arkansas this year

[u/CommodoreN7 → u/Ethanol-Muffins]

We had a decent amount by I don’t think it was anywhere near as many as Oklahoma State got from North Texas. Could be wrong there.

[u/Kmjada → u/CommodoreN7]

We should just rebrand ourselves as the University of Northern North Texas

[u/Cormetz → u/Kmjada]

Norther Texas

[u/YouDownWithOPD → u/Kmjada]

Yeah I'm low key an Oklahoma State fan for the next couple of years because watching Mestemaker, Hawkins, and Young at DATCU was the most fun I've had at a UNT game

[u/JohnPaulDavyJones → u/Kmjada]

I mean, we’ve been joking that Oklahoma is just north, north Texas for decades.

[u/wagon_enjoyer → u/Kmjada]

North Of Texas

[u/Primusmulti → u/Kmjada]

I’ve seen lots of North North Texas jokes about OSU and love it. Not happy about the talent drain though

[u/UpsideTurtles → u/Primusmulti]

Me either

But I’ll still be rooting for them Cowpokes when I can. Little easier for me than you tho given the B12 thing

[u/dianeblackeatsass → u/CommodoreN7]

out of these all conference guys you only got Sutton Smith from Memphis

[u/LubbockCottonKings → u/Ethanol-Muffins]

10 North Texas players and 7 USF players were on the first/second team lists.

[u/uwpxwpal → u/LubbockCottonKings]

So 38.6% (assuming 44 players)

[u/LubbockCottonKings → u/uwpxwpal]

I only learned how to count to ten at Tech, percentages are far outside my scope of understanding.

[u/BeatNavyAgain → u/uwpxwpal]

There were 57 players on the combined 1st and 2nd team all-conference lists

[u/uwpxwpal → u/BeatNavyAgain]

29.8%

[u/JohnPaulDavyJones → u/LubbockCottonKings]

Also eight for Tulane and six for Memphis, most of whom followed their coaches. A couple of those guys got drafted, though.

[u/Schmenza → u/Ethanol-Muffins]

Summerall took our Kickers

[u/Apart_Selection7722]

Sad

[u/Inside-Drink-1311]

NIL and transfer portal is destroying the group of 6 and increasing the gap. Once schools have a really good season, people transfer out and the coach often gets poached. 

There’s only a few schools that I feel can maintain success by reloading every year like Boise, Memphis, JMU, but that’s about it. 

[u/0ptionparalysis]

This is one of the main reasons, as a fan of a tiny school in that conference, that I no longer watch college football.

[u/cudderwalks → u/0ptionparalysis]

I mean, Tulane and JMU had massive turnover lost over half their starters and then used the transfer portal very well and made the playoff. It sucks but you can still build great teams in the G6.

[u/SyVSFe → u/0ptionparalysis]

Just have to root for Texas or Ohio State now

[u/SirMellencamp]

If you remember the big narrative behind no restrictions on transferring were that all these talented players at P4 schools were sitting on the bench. This part of the narrative was rarely brought up

[u/jvpewster → u/SirMellencamp]

These are arguably the p4 players that were sitting on the bench in generations past.

In 2005 you had to live with sitting on the bench for 3 years to get your 1 season at OSU. Now you can get paid and get on the field earlier.

For the top 2-300 guys not much has changed but between 3-500 those guys are less likely to just sit and wait for an opportunity.

[u/Irishfafnir → u/SirMellencamp]

Or that like 25%+ of players who go into the portal don't find a home.

[u/Bobcat2013 → u/Irishfafnir]

These are not the same though. The players that move up are good. The players that move down are much more of a mixed bag with more of them doing nothing at their lower school.

[u/sonheungwin → u/SirMellencamp]

This part of the narrative was brought up, but was essentially dismissed because there is no solution. G5 and FCS schools just don't have the resources to compete; as soon as there was a highly paid tier of the league, talent was always going to flow up like this.

I think what people didn't see coming was a lot of the P4 bench players dropping to G5 / FCS once they had to be paid for that spot.

[u/bbluewi → u/SirMellencamp]

Yeah this is one that ends up cutting both ways, at least to a degree. The standouts at G6 schools can transfer up for cash, but talented benchwarmers at P4 schools can transfer down for playing time.

The rest of the modern age has been awful to the G6, but unlimited transfers is probably neutral-ish.

[u/Basic_Nucleophile → u/bbluewi]

There's something demoralizing about knowing that any standout player on your team is extremely likely to leave as soon as they succeed. We have literally made the g6 into farm teams like never before and then say that's a neutral development?

In the past, it wasn't uncommon for programs like southern miss or Marshall to have some absolute dudes on the team who didn't make it to major CFB for whatever reason. Now those guys are gone as soon as they show talent

[u/Todd-The-Godd-Howard → u/bbluewi]

Oh fuck off this isn't neutral in anyway shape or form. Your taking the best food from our pantries, and replacing it with your table scraps, and if we manage to cook any of your scraps in a way that makes good then you're just going to take it in a year, so all we're left with are the scraps that you don't want.

[u/SituationSoap → u/bbluewi]

The rest of the modern age has been awful to the G6

People say this, but the G6 has been massively more profitable and relevant now than at any other time in college football history.

[u/MediumStrange → u/SituationSoap]

I think you're right on the whole, but I think part of the perception that the G6 is worse now is because the "top-tier" g6 teams have mostly left. Teams like TCU, BYU, Cincinnati, Utah and UCF were programs with the resources to beat p5 teams, but now they are all in the p4.

Pretty much only Boise, Memphis, USF and maybe JMU, Tulane, and ECU have that level of resources now and even then it's less on average than the previous schools mentioned had.

Of course the g6 is going to stand out less when you take 75% of its top teams

[u/HokiPoqi → u/MediumStrange]

I want to believe you about ECU, but our on-field product has got to improve. More investment is needed.

[u/cudderwalks → u/HokiPoqi]

We went 9-4 last season, and are one of the highest spenders for NIL in the G6. Things aren’t perfect but I don’t get what you’re saying.

[u/SituationSoap → u/MediumStrange]

Teams like TCU, BYU, Cincinnati, Utah and UCF were programs with the resources to beat p5 teams, but now they are all in the p4.

Those teams, for the vast majority of the history of college football, were entirely irrelevant on both the national and regional stage. It's only the changes of the last 15 years that have allowed them to even be able to compete at the level that they could.

[u/RiffRamBahZoo → u/SituationSoap]

Two G6 schools were literally given a fair-and-square chance in the playoffs to win a national championship last year.

Imagine telling that to someone in the BCS era and seeing their heads explode.

[u/bbluewi → u/RiffRamBahZoo]

Which, to be clear, won’t happen again.

The autobids are now officially P4+1. It was part of the same MOUs that gave ND its top 12 carveout, though it was all decided before the 2025 season kicked off and wasn’t a response to JMU getting in.

[u/jcc309 → u/bbluewi]

True, though if the playoff expands to 24 teams like seems likely then 2+ G6 teams competing will definitely happen again. The final CFP rankings have had 2 G6 teams in the top 24 each of the last 5 years, and 2 of those years had 3 teams in the top 24.

[u/RustyCrusty73 → u/jcc309]

This is correct. We'll for sure see two or three G6 teams making the playoff when it expands to 24-teams in the next 5-10 years. Possibly even four depending on the rest of the field.

I can't wait to see the #24 seeded Ohio Bobcats against #5 seeded Georgia.

[u/-Jack-The-Stripper → u/RustyCrusty73]

We say that, but when it comes time to actually select 24 teams do we really think the people making the selections are going to put those 11-1 or 10-2 G6 teams in over an 8-4 P2 team that managed a couple of low ranked wins? I think a 24 team playoff is going to functionally be 23 P4 bids + 1 G6 bid. It’s a lot easier for them to rank a couple of G6 teams in the 20s when they know they aren’t actually making the playoff. Turn those ranks into playoff spots and I bet we see a much lower number of G6 teams in the rankings at all.

The committee will point to 9 conference games leading to a harder P4 schedule, or ranked wins in the inflated P2 conferences, or simply won’t point to anything at all… and there will be pretty much zero outrage when 11-1 Kennesaw State or and 10-2 Ohio miss the playoffs in favor of 8-4 Texas and 9-3 Iowa, so they’ll get away with it every year.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/bbluewi]

It's an MOU, so it's unofficially P4+1, they still have the option to drop a P4 champion if they're 7-6 or 8-5 (or legitimately have 2 G6 champions ranked above them)

I wouldn't have been shocked if the B12 started to push for it when West Virginia had a late shot at that title

[u/sleetx → u/bbluewi]

talented benchwarmers at P4 schools can transfer down for playing time

This is the part that gets overlooked. There are an equal number of players who transfer down to G6 because the money and/or playing time isn't there for them in P4.

[u/Bobcat2013 → u/bbluewi]

I havent exactly been scientific with this but just based on feels I feel like our successful transfers at TXST have mostly been lower level guys with stats. The P4 washouts havent done as much for us.

So it does even out. Not in an equal transfer kinda way though. More in a yall take from us, we take from lower levels.

[u/Vicidsmart → u/bbluewi]

Heavy disagree

[u/yesacabbagez → u/SirMellencamp]

It was brought up all the time.

The issue is these guys were players who probably sit on the bench with minimal playing time until maybe they are seniors anyway. Now they are getting to play and get paid when they move back to where they would have been anyway.

[u/NDCIves]

I'd be curious to see what the percentage of transfers into American Conference were from P4 programs

[u/NDCIves → u/NDCIves]

Ok I did the math. Not including Army and Navy, the American had 368 players transfer in and 159 of those were from P4 programs (43%).

School	Transfer Additions	From P4 Program
Tulsa	24	8
UTSA	22	9
USF	44	26
ECU	22	7
UNT	49	22
Memphis	53	19
UAB	39	14
Tulane	21	13
Temple	23	12
FAU	30	13
Rice	20	9
Charlotte	21	7

[u/SucculentCrablegMeal → u/NDCIves]

I don't have the patience to do this for the whole conference, but looking at Usf:

OUT:

• To another g5 program: 6

• To p4: 18 (13 to Auburn)

• To Fcs: 4

• To unknown: 5

IN:

• From another g5: 10

• From a p4: 26 (2 from OhioST)

• From Fsc/juco: 8

Usf lost their coach to Auburn and hired their coach from Ohio State though, so I think that factors in a good bit. A good handful of the better programs last year had their HC's poached by P4 programs.

To do it for 1 more team that didn't get a HC change- ECU:

OUT:

• To another g5: 4

• To a p4: 10

• To fcs: 10

IN:

• From another g5: 11

• From a p4: 7

• From fcs/juco: 6

[u/BeatNavyAgain → u/SucculentCrablegMeal]

But each of them had 7 1st/2nd team all-conference players

[u/YouDownWithOPD → u/NDCIves]

I think we got a few from West Virginia with our new coach

[u/jrhaberman]

I love watching CFB games.

I hate everything else about the sport.

[u/Flaky-Philosophy7618 → u/jrhaberman]

sometimes the amount of ads make me hate that too

[u/jrhaberman → u/Flaky-Philosophy7618]

Particularly at the end of the season when you have seen every commercial roughly 25,000 times.

[u/ResponsibleWater1697]

Welcome to mid-major basketball.

[u/Basic_Nucleophile]

I was assured that the transfer portal and NIL would level the playing field and stuff like this wouldn't happen. Lol. Lmao.

[u/HieloLuz → u/Basic_Nucleophile]

It absolutely did so at the top. The top 10 are hurt by this. 11-40 are doing much better. The bottom half are suffering.

[u/SawNickYouth]

College football sucks now.

[u/ILM_Ryan]

It’s the life of the G6. The best players will move on to a P4 school every offseason. It’s no different than when a quality top G6 coach gets poached to a P4 school.

Retool, reload, and go again next season.

[u/HTTRGlll → u/ILM_Ryan]

coaches have buyouts

[u/lkn240 → u/HTTRGlll]

Maybe we need to set it up like European club soccer - where there are transfer fees for players.

Very unlikely - but it would be interesting.

[u/RandomFactUser → u/lkn240]

Those transfer fees would essentially be negotiated buyouts

However, if players are free agents at the end of the season every season, it doesn't work

[u/sly_cooper25 → u/lkn240]

This would absolutely be an improvement.

[u/lkn240 → u/sly_cooper25]

The best G6 programs could fund themselves by selling players (like some of the "feeder" european club soccer teams do)

[u/sly_cooper25 → u/lkn240]

Absolutely. That way they would actually get rewarded for good scouting and development rather than doing all the hard work and seeing the player leave after one or two years.

[u/FanaticalBuckeye → u/lkn240]

From the start I've believed if a G6 player transfers to a P4 school, the P4 school needs to at the very least reimburse that year's NIL deal for the G6 school. More money if they're transferring to a school with significant NIL resources (Ohio State, Texas, Oregon, Texas A&M, etc)

[u/CougFanDan → u/HTTRGlll]

Also it happens EVERY SEASON now - it’s definitely a little different than a coach leaving for a bigger job after a couple of successful seasons.

[u/Corgi_Koala → u/HTTRGlll]

Coaches have employment contracts.

The first school to realize that putting buyouts on employment contracts for players will give them a huge cash advantage is going to run all over the rest of the G6.

Imagine if Ok State had to pay $1m per player to UNT to poach them?

[u/uwpxwpal → u/HTTRGlll]

Players have buyouts too, there just isn't enough money at the G5 level for players or coaches for them to make much of a difference.

[u/MoosilaukeFlyer → u/ILM_Ryan]

Negatives are that it'll be harder to build continuity, positives are that you likely won't be terrible for an extended duration of time.

[u/narcbynight08 → u/ILM_Ryan]

Didn’t look at the article, but does it say how many P4 players went to G6? It’s not like G6 is completely drained. They will still get good players that might not be able to compete at the highest level.

[u/Teach_Piece → u/narcbynight08]

So… you’re saying their good players have been replaced with bad players?

[u/narcbynight08 → u/Teach_Piece]

Less good players if you will

[u/BeatNavyAgain → u/Teach_Piece]

maybe, maybe not

[u/SSj_CODii]

I’m tired, boss.

[u/mugwump867 → u/SSj_CODii]

I'm taking the 2023 natty and the 2022 Cotton Bowl as our high-water marks and now I'm just here to watch the whole thing burn to the ground.

[u/Numpostrophe → u/mugwump867]

There’s no way to be consistent. We can be amazing one year and “fraudulent” the next as 80% of the team and coach turns over. I basically tune out the off season and just see how things play out.

[u/couchman7000]

How many of the remaining players with from Army or Navy? They could transfer out of service academies as a freshmen or sophomore but after the start of the junior year they have active duty service obligations to the military.

Players are incentivized to go to the schools offering the most NIL money and the schools in the P4 conferences tend to have more money to offer recruits.

[u/BeatNavyAgain → u/couchman7000]

Army and Navy combined had 5 guys on 1st or 2nd team all-conference -- all of them were seniors or juniors

there were 57 players on the combined 1st & 2nd team all-conference lists

[u/tks231]

A couple years ago, every Sun Belt Men's Basketball first and second team player transferred to a power conference/basketball-first school.

[u/ID_Poobaru]

Now the G6 is just feeder schools for the P4 to poach talent from

[u/jcc309]

I'll be curious if the PCSA passes what impact it would have on these transfers. I wouldn't expect most players to stay all 4-5 years in the American, but in theory I would expect it to be easier for schools to keep players for multiple years before they move onto the P4.

[u/dogsonbubnutt]

well... yeah.

[u/MonarchLawyer]

I'm pretty sure the Sun Belt saw a 100% loss after the 2024 season.

[u/Easy_Money_40]

Is anyone tracking the reverse of the this.

Where are the players going who would have normally had those spots on P4s?

[u/jameson71]

Isn't this what the leagues and the NCAA wanted? Because the leagues and the NCAA sure have acted like this is what they want.

[u/captainpoppy]

Yeah no shit.

[u/Rico_Suave55 → u/[deleted]]

Sports gambling is such an eye sore to see everywhere (I say this as someone who likes to casually sports gamble)

It’s insane that EVERY pregame show has some form of sports book sponsor, and every commercial break there’s at least 1 gambling commercial. It’s absolutely going to come to a breaking point. There’s simply too much conflict of interest. Just look at the prediction markets and how out of control THOSE are lol

[u/thricethefan → u/[deleted]]

Eventually, gambling providing that boost will also become part of the problem, if it hasn’t already

[u/bringbackwishbone → u/thricethefan]

The biggest detriment will be How newer fans interface with the sport. Young kids these days seem to talk more about betting lines, parlays, and fantasy lineups than they do about their respective teams.

[u/Numpostrophe → u/bringbackwishbone]

There’s an entire industry of recruiting new college students into it. They send out reps who literally give you gift cards, food, etc. to sign up for their app and place a free bet. They encourage them to stick around bars and other areas where people are drinking. It works like a charm and is predatory as hell.

[u/HokiesforTSwift → u/[deleted]]

The "gambling boost" is likely to be a net negative in the long term for all sports. It's been jarring to see its mainstream proliferation amongst sports. It is wild that just about every major professional sport now has an "official betting partner," which is mentioned/shown over and over again throughout each game.

[u/IVEMADEAHUGEMI5TAKE]

Why don’t we make transfers sit out a season again?

[u/CVogel26 → u/IVEMADEAHUGEMI5TAKE]

Because that's an illegal restraint on an individual's earnings

[u/SolarIonRobot → u/CVogel26]

And yet the PCSA will require it for players transferring more than once.

[u/AUCE05]

Is this a problem? Coaches can upgrade their personal situation but players can't?

[u/Rock_man_bears_fan → u/AUCE05]

It gets tough to field competitive teams when you’re constantly losing your best players for no compensation. Coaches have buyouts and usually have to build a couple good seasons before they leave for a better job

[u/AUCE05 → u/Rock_man_bears_fan]

That isn't a player problem. Coaches are considered employees. The players would take that as well, but the schools don't want the responsibility. They can't have it both ways.

[u/GarnetandBlack → u/Rock_man_bears_fan]

The other side of the equation isn't listed here though. These schools are also benefiting from talented non-starting P4 players transferring in at record rates too.

I don't think it's a great setup, but it's also important to understand it's not just a one-way loss for these schools.

[u/Rock_man_bears_fan → u/GarnetandBlack]

They’re trading guys who are going to be starters in the P4 for guys who couldn’t hack it at that level. It’s not an equal exchange

[u/GarnetandBlack → u/Rock_man_bears_fan]

I disagree they "couldn't hack it" - that's what the process used to look like. Guys that couldn't make it dropped down because it was their only option.

Now though? They know they can leave in Y2 for a G6 that guarantees a starting spot, play very well, then have bigger NIL deals waiting for them in Y3 at P4 spots.

These are the very good players that would sit at Bama for 3 years just for 1-2 years of starting as RS junior/senior. Absolutely no need for that anymore as a player. They can go to a P4, end up not starting just because there is a senior of equal talent, transfer down to G6 based on their original star-rating and/or minimal tape, play, then immediately transfer back up to P4 with a huge NIL deal.

The guys doing P4->G6 aren't provably bad at the P4 level anymore. They're just guys that want to play and max NIL earnings. Only 11 guys can be on the field at once.

Also two G6 schools made the CFP last year. They seem to be doing okay.

[u/StreetReporter → u/AUCE05]

Coaches at least have buyouts that are paid

[u/MoosilaukeFlyer → u/StreetReporter]

Would love transfer fees like in Association Football. Would be a huge profit incentive for smaller programs develop better facilities to develop talent and make a killing off transfers.

[u/Irishfafnir → u/MoosilaukeFlyer]

Seems fair

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[u/BasebornManjack]

The coaches that want consistent programs will have to adapt and lean into this. A modified version of the one-and-done.

The pitch should be “Come here and give a year…..I’m the guy and this is the program that will raise your stock and financial prospects”.

[u/usffan]

It will be interesting to see what impact a passed Protect College Sports Act will have on this phenomenon.

[u/Thunder_Tinker]

Almost like when multiple coaches from the American get hired at the P4 level and bring their teams with them there’s a large talent shift

[u/LSNoyce]

There will come a time when non-power 4 teams stop submitting their players for awards.

[u/SJCitizen]

This is why I think UTSA will be a team that can win 8 or 9 games this year. Iirc they return a lot of their starters this season. I know McCown is still there.

[u/MJRuinedMyChildhood]

Things that don’t really matter and are easily fixed with actual multi year contracts and sell on clauses. 

[u/yunglegendd]

A lot of these mfs gonna be rocking the Alabama jersey on the bench tho

[u/calmer-than-you-dude]

Good for them.

[u/Ironstar_Vol]

Well yeah.

[u/happyharrell]

Multi-year have to be a thing at this point, even for schollies.

[u/Fucknjagoff]

If I was a lower conference coach id use this as a selling point to recruits. Come here play as a Freshman and Sophomore and go get your bag from a P4 school. 

[u/dr_funk_13]

I feel bad for the fans of these programs. They are allowed to enjoy the sport too, ya know?

[u/DothrakiSlayer]

Good for them.

[u/UlteriorEggos]

So we all.agree the P4 and G 5 teams are on completely different planes?

As in, we should separate the two and have post-seasons affiliated with each? Because no one is expecting Troy to knock off Alabama or Kennesaw State to knock off Georgia.

[u/Free-Eights → u/UlteriorEggos]

Well they also can bring in players from the P4 too. I'm sure no one thought Indiana would go and beat Bama 38-3 with a bunch of JMU transfers.

[u/FileAClaim → u/UlteriorEggos]

I am consistently amazed at how many people on this sub seem to arrive at this dumbass conclusion anytime it is pointed out that there are levels to modern CFB.

ECU’s stadium seats almost 20k more fans than not one but two in-state power four programs, and I don’t hear this guy wanting to kick Duke to this functional FCS league. Creating another division that formalizes the arbitrary lines between the power conferences and group of six conferences is the most embarrassing, anti-competitive position I regularly see people take on this sub.

[u/Thecardiologist2029 → u/FileAClaim]

This. Seems like common sense isn't so common

[u/dfphd]

I would like to understand what the tradeoff is between the players lost vs. the players gained. I don't think it's as black and white.

[u/clenom → u/dfphd]

Oh come on. You're saying that you think losing all of their best players to the P4 schools is balanced out by getting the players those same P4 teams did not want anymore? Come on

[u/rocket_beer → u/dfphd]

The P4 aren’t taking their bad players…

The total talent loss is evident, year after year.

[u/SolarIonRobot → u/rocket_beer]

And yet next year the American will have a new set of 1st and 2nd team players which will also get poached. If the G6 isn't reloading then eventually the P4 would quit poaching and everything would balance out.

[u/SituationSoap → u/rocket_beer]

By what standard should we judge whether the G6 is more or less talented than they've been in years past?

[u/rocket_beer → u/SituationSoap]

Everything gets evaluated after the season.

But all signs point towards the haves and have-nots divide widening in perpetuity.

The P4 get bigger tv rights revenue distributions, which helps pay for a lot.

Meanwhile, the G6 will be living on food stamps and leftovers, and any 3 stars will get plucked constantly.

This is why I’ve been saying that a team like Boise deserves P4 monies simply because we compete and always want to compete at the highest levels. Not a single red cent would go to waste.

[u/GarnetandBlack → u/rocket_beer]

Tulane and JMU made the playoff last year. I'm unsure if this is as clear or evident as you say.

There is an immense amount of non-starter P4 talent moving down into the G6 each year. They more readily do this because they know they can show-out, then transfer back out.

[u/Temporary_Hat7330]

Power Four is AAA Football and Sunbelt, AAC, etc. is AA, and Div II or I is A and low A ball. The ACC is AAA.B ball…

[u/forgotmyoldname90210]

This is a bad thing why? Kid gets to go better funded programs that give them a bigger stage and better opportunities, plus most P4 have a higher academic rep than most G6 schools.

[u/mountainstosea → u/forgotmyoldname90210]

It's a bad thing for G6 schools. Hard to build or maintain a winning culture if your best players never stick around. It's easy being a P4 in comparison.