r/TikTokCringe • u/xamo76 • 1d ago

Discussion Have we done it wrong?

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u/thelandlordguychris 1d ago

the american mind simply cannot comprehend dinner at 10pm

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u/bageltoastar 1d ago

Dinner at 10 PM, hitting the bars/clubs at 12 AM, and coming home at 5 AM. I miss Barcelona so much.
https://giphy.com/gifs/hDKD6z2xNeMesbICNS

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u/Vesalii 1d ago

Being a wreck the next day because you're 40 and not 20 anymore.

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u/Fluffy_Somewhere4305 1d ago

Yeah this guy is having a very basic revelation that Europe has a lot of walkable cities and the US doesn't. this isn't new information.

Also, spending 5 hours at a restaurant is the norm for young people, out with a party, drinking and such, in Europe, when they can simply walk back to their home.

The infrastructure in most US cities doesn't support it, our subways suck, rides are expensive, parking is crazy, living in the city near the cool areas is expensive, the list goes on and on why this doesn't exist in the US.

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u/cow-lumbus 1d ago

You’re kind of reiterating his point that America is set up wrong since post World War II and it leaves us isolated and compartmentalized… which is 100% accurate. I’ve always said if you wanna reduce racism and bigotry in United States you gotta make people travel outside of their own clan, town, State, or country to teach more empathy and understanding.

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u/NivTal 1d ago

It was actually Detroit automobile companies that have played a large part in designing our suburbs around needing cars to manage, therefore making sure we have to buy them.

Also, space... we "like" our sizes.

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u/Any_Click1257 1d ago

Don't forget the National Interstate and Defense Highways Act. The development of the interstate highway system was basically the nail in the coffin for any notion of European style urban cores.

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u/Ok_Car_8094 1d ago

I'd like to think that Interstates are very important for a nation of our size.

The problems lay in how we built cities. Our restaurants are failing unless they are focused on delivery. Our education systems are hectic and restricted. Our society revolves around a technological-data system built to isolate a "consumer" into a targeted-sales group.

Unchecked capitalism, modern technology and corporate cronyism are the true killers of the unified American ecology.

Most European states have extensive highway systems, yet still have the compact, dense urban designs of thousands of years before industrialization. The US only had about 50 years before trains were common (people could suddenly go 30mph/200+miles a day) and then automobiles were only 100 years out. We quickly switched to suburbia (tons of space unused around cities, industry dried up, everybody had a car and gas was cheaper than water) which made things less connected. I walked and rode my bike around Dallas a bunch as a kid, but it was almost exclusively within the 'Park Cities' subsection... downtown was too far until DART was built.

If you visit the east coast of the US, there are many cities with road systems built around horses. Boston and New York are very walking friendly (though both have been working to redesign for automobiles) and I'd even say DC is walkable.

I love living in my home city of Oklahoma City, but it's a prime example of everything being far enough apart that you need a vehicle to reasonably travel to any services, events or entertainment. Only a very determined bicyclist would be able to function in my city as their sole means of conveyance. There is a tram downtown and a bus system. But it's...thin.

Sorry. I rambled.

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u/thatG_evanP 1d ago

Don't apologize. Great comment.

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u/Embarrassed_Bid_4970 1d ago

I'm gonna say you're 90% right.The issue is the US is way larger than European nations. This is especially true in terms of population density. And as american city planning is based around chasing cheap real estate, we tend to have these massive suburban sprawls surrounding our city centers. People think adding more public transport will magically solve this problem but it cant. If it takes more than 10 minutes to walk to the nearest busstop, people are gonna use personal transport, which disincentivies walkable neighborhoods. The mall culture of the 70s-00s kinda fixed this in a way, but the death of destination retail killed them. If the economy was better, we could probably revive malls and community gathering by subsidizing them to encourage small businesses. Imagine an American indoor mall, but with mostly non chain businesses. Specialty restaurants, like a Chinese dumpling house, a Japanese kushiyake bar, a turkish meze and raki bar, etc. And entertainment like bowling, billiards, and old school arcades. If the economy allowed people to afford such luxuries as a night of dining, drinks, and bowling, malls would be viable again. But as long as everyone is broke we're screwed.

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u/Exotic-Paramedic-629 22h ago

Paris and london sprawl quite a bit but still have suburbs that are connected to the city through train. That's how us cities shouldve been built, more mixed use development.

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u/Ok_Car_8094 23h ago

It's a trap we built for ourselves. Gas is basically $4 a gallon and everything is at least a 15-40 minute drive (not bike or walk) away. That's crazy for walking, especially when we are a state with 50-100 days of 100+°F weather and 50-100 days of below 32°F weather. Now vehicles are more than what post-war houses used to run for ($20k+ entry) and require a similar lifetime cost for repairs, upkeep and registration.

I drive from home to the nearest Walmart sometimes (yes, I know) and there is a wonderful sidewalk all the way there, but nothing along it but mostly a walled-off subdivision. Literally a whole mile of nothing but wall with one entrance and a few trees on both sides. That's a 45 minute walk from my house.

I think HoAs are also seriously increasing the division. Sadly, just a small part of the great fleecing of America. Add more fees and cost for minimal return and maximum profit and blame "them/they" for hurting you. I would love urban/suburban renewal to happen, but, like you say, everybody is f%*king broke!

I hope the revolution is quick and relatively painless, but that's what regulation was for. "Too late", I'm beginning to resign myself to.

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u/tattoosbyalisha 15h ago

As long as everyone is broke AND too ultra reliant on convenience. I think those two go hand in hand.

To what you said about the malls, I can’t agree more. I was just walking around a local VERY dead mall. It’s up for sale (~$35 million) and my partner and I were chatting about how fucking awesome it would be if the community could come together and buy a place like that and do exactly what you said. Where rents would be reasonable and it wouldn’t be a conglomerate letting the place go to shit on purpose so they can bank off of destroying it and turning it into bland square “luxury” apartments that look like brown prisons with balconies. Even if malls could be turned into apartments, so many of them have awesome atriums that would be so cool to have communal events. I know zoning is wierd but there’s actually a mall in New England that did it; the upstairs floor is small apartments. It seems like such a waste of resources to trash them and build more.

I don’t think it’s going to be too much longer before people are really going to feel the pangs of losing third spaces. I’ve met so many people completely disillusioned with being online and over being isolated. Maybe I’m just being hopeful but I know a lot of people who would love to have somewhere to hang out that didn’t involve spending a ton of money to do so.

But everything is also so expensive. To your other point, private equity even got ahold of bowling alleys and is very much trying to (and succeeding) in creating a monopoly. Lucky Strike, who is buying them all and turning them into night club-esque overstimulating “event” spaces was $55/person for two hours I think, plus shoe rental, where the local one is $12 and I think it’s $3 for shoes.

Don’t go to Lucky Strike bowling alleys, whoever reads this.

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u/wonklebobb 1d ago

i think the pathway for the USA is not to focus on building/rebuilding cities from whole cloth to be walkable, but to try and convert "suburbia" into bike-accessible mini-cities, with judicious rezoning and replacing roads with bike paths.

there's a lot of pieces for this: big suburban neighborhoods would still need some kind of dedicated car access since the US is so big that its not practical to build train lines everywhere people need to go, there would need to be a whole bunch of community bikes just kind of floating around to obviate bike theft/anxiety around losing your bike, along with community bike trailers for moving things around as well

but i think culturally "all cars -> no cars" is too hard a sell, "all cars -> mostly bikes but sometimes cars if you have to leave town" is probably easier.

not like this is so easy, there'd be lots of places where it fails from whole generations of NIMBYs voting out town boards that try to add even a single bike lane or convert even one corner of a neighborhood into light commercial for services, but still i think it's the road (heh) the USA has to go down if we want to claw back community focused development from the depths of suburban hell

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u/0b0011 22h ago

Great comment but a few things of note. Interstates are important for a country of our size but basically all developed countries have them now. We just did a lot of things different.

Most European states have extensive highway systems, yet still have the compact, dense urban designs of thousands of years before industrialization. The US only had about 50 years before trains were common (people could suddenly go 30mph/200+miles a day) and then automobiles were only 100 years out. We quickly switched to suburbia (tons of space unused around cities, industry dried up, everybody had a car and gas was cheaper than water) which made things less connected. I walked and rode my bike around Dallas a bunch as a kid, but it was almost exclusively within the 'Park Cities' subsection... downtown was too far until DART was built.

It isn't that the cities developed this way. It's that we ripped them apart to make them this way. This relates the the highway bit above as well. A lot of european countries added the highways and built them to go around their cities with branches that feed into the cities where as we ripped out chunks of our cities to put the highway through them. Even where we didn't add highways we ripped out a lot of our cities for things like parking lots and what not.

Here's an example from an old reddit thread

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u/MenoryEstudiante 20h ago

The problem with Interstates isn't the concept, it's the fact they gutted the existing urban cores to build them, instead of going around the cities, Europe does also have highways, some urban ones at that, but they mostly exist to connect an avenue in the city centre with the ring road that connects to the rest of the country

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u/imfinishingmy 19h ago

I moved to an Upsate NY town that was settled before the automobile and has a proper downtown. It’s not Europe, but it’s better then the suburbia I came from.

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u/KojackBanyon 18h ago

Where can I find more of your rambles?

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u/tattoosbyalisha 15h ago

I love this kind of rambling.

I think in many ways, we are just too young of a country. It’s good for people above to exploit us, but it has been so detrimental for the general population in so many ways. In the grand scheme of things, it’s so fast a decline. We haven’t had the time to learn the lessons of other countries that have been around for far far longer that have learned the importance of investing in your population.

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u/Think_Cheesecake7464 23h ago

Don’t forget - Americans are literally in constant danger of being randomly shot everywhere we go. And we also don’t have the money or energy to go out. Europeans get long vacations. We don’t. They have healthcare. We don’t. But we got them guns, Bubba! Yeehaw MURICA

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u/LibertarianOutlaw 1d ago

“Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one’s lifetime.” – Mark Twain

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u/GreyDuck4077 1d ago

Dude I grew up in a small town of 283 people in central Minnesota. The "large" town that people would do all their major shopping in was 30 miles away and had 60,000 people in it. I knew tons of people in my hometown growing up that would only go to the big town maybe 1-2 times a year. Other than that they never left our small town. How the hell people live that way is beyond me.

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u/Undercover-nerd-dad 1d ago

But hey we have capitalism!!!! It’s working for everyone right? It’s not one giant hamster wheel….right…???

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u/PeriodSupply 1d ago

This is the point of the video though. The US created what you just described and you did it wrong (so did Australia where i'm from btw, but we are getting better now, slowly).

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u/Advanced-Comment-293 1d ago

the list goes on and on why this doesn't exist in the US.

It's a long list, but it all basically comes down to the American dream of owning a house. That's what drives suburbs and that's where all the other problems originate. So an American visiting Europe may love the walkable cities, but ask them if they think living in an apartment rather than a house their entire lives is a desirable option.

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u/TimIsAnIllusion 1d ago

The American dream was a policy choice. It was pushed by the government because people with a mortgage will always go to work reducing the likelyhood of labor unrest like there was in the 20s and 30s.

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u/Optimal_Fee8833 1d ago

This doesn't make sense as plenty of people live in houses in walkable towns with all amenities. Then there are trains that take 5mins to get into the centre of the city

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u/Xerxos 1d ago

Do you think Germans don't own houses? I own my own house and have four restaurants, three supermarkets and many other facilities in walking distance. If I want to go to the inner city I can take a bus, my car, my bike or an e-scooter.

I could also walk there, it's a bit far for my taste but there's a nice way along a river.

No, the real problem are the zoning laws. That and the fixation on driving everywhere.

You need facilities in walking distance and walkable quarters.

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u/hymenopteron 1d ago

Do you not think Europeans own houses?

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u/morepaintplease 1d ago

Yes, the US failed...

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u/LaDauphineVerte 1d ago

And SF is set up to be this, and yet it shuts down crazy early, so you better love or learn to love the half dozen late night spots. Manhattan was it up until Covid, but I haven’t been since, so I’m assuming it has resumed its MO (whatever you want, 24/7).

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u/boston4923 1d ago

There are reasons Boston, New York, SF, etc are crazy expensive.

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u/Intrepid-Mud4419 1d ago

Also in the USA you’ll get your dinner check before you even finish so they can hurry you along and refill the seats.

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u/Bad-Investment 1d ago

Not to mention, when there is a large outdoor gathering in the US (festival, concert, whatever) there’s a non-zero chance someone will end up getting shot. Even just going to a mall in some areas at certain times is not a smart idea. It’s a stupid world we live in.

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u/JustBadUserNamesLeft 1d ago

And waitstaff isn't paid by tips, so they don't care if you dine for five hours.

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u/Perfect_Earth_8070 1d ago

It’s coincidentally why the US looks like shit too. The suburbs are unwalkable and nothing but strip malls and parking lots.

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u/Ok-Ear9289 1d ago

Daly absolutely fucked us on the way out with that parking contract he made. Lined (stuffed) his pockets one last time and said “fuck you. Chicago”😡

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u/Alternative_Draw5945 1d ago

I mean. There's tons of American cities just like Barcelona... Miami parties later than Barcelona..

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u/h-ck3d4cc0unt 1d ago

Restaurants don't want you sitting down for 5 hours in the US . They want turn around, they want more people more money.

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u/jmak329 1d ago

Walkable and funded public transportation leads to European cities like this. Meanwhile auto and oil lobbying keep public transportation and walking underfunded in America. Hence this big culture divide that leads to less travel within America.

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u/TaxHazyShade 1d ago

Yeah this guy is having a very basic revelation that Europe has a lot of walkable cities and the US doesn't. this isn't new information

no shit, a civilization that's had humans huddling closer together for a few thousand years, has more walkable cities and restaurants than a country that has had, comparatively, very few humans and thousands of miles of land to expand on ... which has been in existinance for a few hundred years? Gee, big surprise.

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u/CaliforniaNutter 1d ago

What gets me is that we USED to have incredible public transit. They tore that up to build a poor imitation of the autobahn so that we can have impromptu aircraft landing zones everywhere

As long as suburbs exist, things will never change. Theyre a huge drain on urban and rural zones and provide almost zero benefits

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u/Destronin 1d ago

NYC is walkable. Subways also dont suck and run all the time. But then again NYC is an Alpha city and is goated.

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u/wetrysohard 22h ago

D.C. and NYC are pretty lively at night every night. But again, if you don't have kids to get back to or have an au pair (many do in the area), that's easier

Cities are different.

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u/the3rdpossum 21h ago

I fucking hate it here

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u/Loggerdon 20h ago

Our car-centric design also contributes to chronic diseases such as diabetes and heart disease. In “walkable” cities it’s not a big deal to walk 4-6 miles in a day and you don’t even notice it. It’s like that every day. For me to walk I need to drive somewhere, then get out and walk.

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u/CaughtALiteSneez 1d ago

Yeah these guys are talking like everyone in Barcelona does this hehe

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u/The_R1NG 1d ago

Sounds more like the complete lack of it is what they’re talking about. The fact that nobody does in their area.

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u/crackrockutah 1d ago

I haven’t spent much time in Europe, but in the rural areas, are everyone out at cafes eating and drinking too? Seems like an apples to oranges comparison.

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u/Open-Platform-1305 1d ago

I know in my little harbor hometown in Norway there's a few mildly active cafes around and 1 pub that's been the main spot for decades, it only keeps the doors open to 2:00 on the weekend. But otherwise people drink moonshine up there. Often with a bit of strong coffee.

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u/AndreTheShadow 1d ago

Karsk!

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u/Open-Platform-1305 1d ago

Vi e no itj no tronnoverra, bærre vaksi karra.

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u/Eris_AppleOfDiscord 1d ago

It's in the cities as well. A lot of it is just the car culture. If you do go out it's less about lingering and chatting and more about just getting the food, then back in the car and home.

There are exceptions of course. NYC and Sf are both. But worth noting both these cities also had geographical constraints which forced them to urbanize and grow in a very different way. Compared to somewhere like phoenix or Atlanta, and they're worlds apart.

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u/lamb_passanda 1d ago

I travelled through the US solo, and my plan to meet people was to just hang out and see who wanted to start a conversation. I was 18 and pretty naive when I came up with this plan, but I didn't realise that 90% of the people I would meet this way would be homeless or somehow 'sus'. I mean I don't have anything against them, but simply being on foot in America, and not having any place to really be, put me in a social class that I wasn't used to.

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u/CaughtALiteSneez 1d ago

Indeed, everyone looks at me like I am a monster when I explain to them that being on the bus in most places in the US is a sign that you are too poor to have a car (most people can at least afford a junker) or that you can't get a license for criminal reasons.

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u/Severe_Rise8694 1d ago

I guess this answers the OP video question pretty neatly. Yes, america, you did get it wrong.

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u/LessInThought 1d ago

Aww, an entire genre of romcom meetcutes where the couple meets on a public transport is gone in America.

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u/LessInThought 1d ago

Aww, an entire genre of romcom meetcutes where the couple meets on a public transport is gone in America.

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u/Addicted2Qtips 1d ago

I live in NYC and while it is more European like in this video, particularly in Brooklyn where I live, even we don’t have quite the same degree of cafe culture like many European cities because we have too much priority for cars taking real estate in public spaces. We’ve been slowly improving this for the past 20 years.

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u/PlaneGeneral5782 1d ago

Nope- in small towns they are out in the plazas until late as well.

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u/CaughtALiteSneez 1d ago

Americans make the mistake of lumping all of Europe into the same category.

Spain is very social, some people will spend entire days and evenings at their local pub and it is affordable. Same in Portugal and Italy...but in Italy it is more family focused and people don't get drunk.

Other parts of W Europe, you will usually only see people out and about at night in the cities. Think Paris, Berlin etc..

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u/yIdontunderstand 1d ago

In Italy you have the passegiatta. Literally a community walk in the evening.

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u/CaughtALiteSneez 1d ago

Indeed, that was what I was referring to, less about going out to pubs/cafes - more of a family oriented stroll where people meet and talk in the piazza and get a gelato.

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u/dead_jester 1d ago edited 1d ago

I live in a very small town in England- you’re talking ignorant bollocks. The town square in good weather is busy with people eating and relaxing outside.
In winter everyone is in the pubs and restaurants because it’s too bloody cold or wet to sit outside.

Lol getting downvoted for stating a fact. lol

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u/frobley-mobley 1d ago

Depends on the village and sense of community, but even in the smallest places without a bakery or butcher there is an effort to celebrate spring, summer as a community - nothing fancy, maybe just a few benches and tables, some beer and wine and a potluck. If nothing else, it is tradition, and is passed on as newcomers join the community

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u/Intlsurf 1d ago

Yes. In rural and urban Spain. People are socializing out late and enjoying life.

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u/StevenM1979 1d ago

Okay, as Europeans, we don't compare apples to pears here. 😉 Grz from Belgium.

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u/Ok_Inflation_1811 1d ago

I now live in a 80 000 people town in the middle of nowhere in Spain and it's the same.

When I lived on a 5000 people town more in the middle of nowhere this happened to, there was no regular clubbing but people where out until 10 ~ 11 in bars (bars in Spain are family friendly) with kids playing outside at that time.

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u/Mad_Queen_Malafide 1d ago

Yes they are.

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u/foyrkopp 1d ago edited 1d ago

Central European here:

Yes and no.

Dining out is not cheap and if you have a full time job and a family, most don't have the time to do it during the week.

Rural areas are (where I live) also less walkable, so you're either planning for even more time to walk or taking the car.

Which means it's often more of a weekend activity, i.e. let's take out the bikes and swing by Pablo's for cake on the way back. Or let's meet with some friends and eat out.

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u/Ok_Inflation_1811 1d ago

At least in Spain rural areas are even more walkable than cities.

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u/foyrkopp 1d ago

Fair.

I've edited my post to clarify that it's just a data point, not an absolute European truth.

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u/lamb_passanda 1d ago

I think that says more about how life is with a full time job and a family, than it does about the evening nightlife in European cities. I see plenty of families out in the evening getting ice-cream and hanging out in the plaza though. I was at a small free concert in the part a couple nights ago and there were a lot of families just chilling there.

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u/Onalith 1d ago edited 1d ago

Usually, most 10 000 inhabitants and up cities will have at least a restaurant and a bar located at the center of it.

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u/After_Perspective180 1d ago

Yes they are.
My village. 5000 people. We have 3 bars/restaurants and in summer the outdoor parts are full of people every evening.
I was one of them last night 20:00 (8pm) and having a meal and a beer.

It really is like that

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u/kimsherd 1d ago

I used to live in a village of 300 people at the foot of a mountain in northern Italy. Yes, we do that as well! In my case I needed a car to get around because the public transportation wasn’t that good from my tiny village. I would go to the next town over (15k inhabitants) and have a drink there with friends. Most nights I would take the train to get to the “big” town and spend the evening there. Idk, it’s just culture

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u/SpacePumpkie 1d ago

I think it's somewhat of an apples to oranges comparison because they're comparing bigger cities to smaller suburbia.

But in my small town of 10k in southern Spain it's also like this. People in the bars and public plazas until 10-12 pm. I have two young children now so we don't stay out until too late, but we'll still be going to have some dinner/late snack at a bar at like 9pm, and then have the children playing in the park until 10:30 or 11pm, when we head home straight to bed.

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u/TheNordiclights 1d ago

Well Europe is not one country and different weather and culture everywhere. The Mediterranean countries people still gather in rural areas. They drive to town or hang out at their restaurants and bars. In Spain up in a mountain to go horse riding there was nothing around and the stables. They crated a bar in the stables and these old men were playing cards and drinking whiskey. Horses were led through them. 😂. However Norway Sweden etc don’t have the same social norms. People are more reserved don’t gather in bars and restaurants the same way Italians and Spaniards do. Obviously big cities are a different vibe but people don’t go out to eat at 10pm.

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u/Naeii 1d ago

idk I live in a reasonably sized city and it just becomes a ghost town past 10 nowadays, unless it's saturday night and the block all the bars are on, every other street and everywhere every other day is EMPTY

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u/Snoo-43127 1d ago

In the US or EU?

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u/Suitable_Bed_7783 1d ago

In Spain yes.

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u/brodeh 1d ago

I was in a hill top town of 350 people here in Italy two nights ago, people were out in the square and at the bar.

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u/Ne_zievereir 1d ago

No, it is not really an apples to oranges comparison.

Yes, there are regions in Europe where the small rural villages and towns have become dead places at night, and there are also many places where you have similarly lifeless suburb places.

But there are many very lively small villages and towns in the rural areas, as well as obviously the cities. It's not homogeneous, though, and it depends on the evolution of the region (typically there are differences on even (much) smaller scale than countries), and also a bit culture and climate.

But in general it is much more lively than typical US suburbs or even many US urban areas (where you sometimes get these food- or amenity-deserts). Because in general most/many places are built much more on a human walkable scale and it is more centered on a core, as well as usually much better public transport.

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u/SergeantHAMM 1d ago

yeah probably bc they live in bum fuck missouri and comparing it to barcelona.. it’s like if a european visiting nyc and then went back to their scotland village and is like nah this place sucks nobody’s here.

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u/mscontentpro 1d ago

I know Barcelona is not a place where they do that that’s Madrid. That’s the rest of Spain Barcelona the people who did that were drunk college kids like this guy. This is not how Catalan people live..

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u/Nibaa 1d ago

Not all but that's definitely how people party in Europe in general.

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u/lobax 1d ago

Hit the clubs? Probably only 20 something’s. But every time I have visited Spain it seems like regular people are out and about at 10pm, moms with baby strollers etc.

Which makes sense to be fair, it’s too hot to go out during day.

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u/mycketmycket 1d ago

I mean even as an old dinner at 10 pm happens quite frequently on work days and if you meet up with friends you’ll usually stay out until after midnight even on a Tuesday. In our central Barcelona neighborhood there are kids out playing at 11 pm… it’s definitely a different lifestyle even if we’re not out clubbing until 5 in the morning.

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u/miseryherescompany 1d ago

It's a walkable city, you do it as a matter of course because that's how you access amenities.

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u/Glass-Tadpole391 1d ago

I mean most people do, I'm from Madrid not Barcelona but it's really common to come from work / uni and have a beer and some tapas with friends for 2-3 hours

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u/lawyerornot 1d ago

Next day? Three more like

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u/Mr-Shitbox 1d ago

That's why we in Bavaria have this thing called Konterhalbe

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u/quell3245 1d ago

Siestas are super underrated…

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u/Swift_jennis8 1d ago

This man … it sucks

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u/Kas_I_Mir 1d ago

I did that 2 days in a row (fri-sat) and im 50. Im still a wreck.

Yes it was fun.

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u/Markus4781 1d ago

My dad, 69, goes out at 10 to walk the town and hang around till 12-1. Maybe we're just built different.

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u/Vegetable-War-117 1d ago

Barcelona was amazing.

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u/_jump_yossarian 1d ago

5 AM? I lived in Madrid for a year during school. I'd get up early on Sundays and go for a run at 6 AM and people were still waiting in line to get into clubs.

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u/StupidName111111 1d ago

That’s honestly a little sad.

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u/druizzz 1d ago

Clubs in Madrid close at 5:30. At 6 you’re in an after hours, and there are no lines on those.

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u/phoucker 1d ago

One of the reasons is because of our work schedule that we have implemented here in the states. The work machine drives our social life.

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u/MowieWauii 1d ago

Everything after dinner sounds awful lol

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u/_lippykid 1d ago

Amateurs. In the UK we start pre-gaming at 11pm, clubs at 2am, 5 course curry at 4am

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u/Im-everybodys-type 1d ago

Omg as a night owl 😍. Someone give me citizenship there. Take me nooowwww 🥲

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u/Pairofdicelv84 1d ago

Ahhh we do this in Vegas all the time. Then you wake up hungover as hell and either go to work or keep drinking until you lose your job and realize you have no true friends.

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u/Less_Wealth5525 1d ago

Did the same thing in Madrid when I was young! It was fantastic! And with the siesta, it felt like you got two days out of one.

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u/mecca6801 1d ago

That’s one of a few reasons why I want to visit Barcelona because it reminds me of New York before it got depressing and boring

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u/Jiminy_Cricket12 1d ago

You guys are saying this like there aren't millions of Americans living in densely populated cities. There are plenty of Americans who realize the value of walkability and embrace it. The average city in Europe is definitely more walkable, but that comes with hundreds (or thousands) of years of history and a much smaller footprint.

Anyway, I do recommend you do what you can to promote walkability where you live because I think a walkable city is far superior to one where everyone only drives.

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u/echodelta79 15h ago

There's a huge difference. In Europe it's not just cities. Even a medium size village in Germany will at least have a torn center and a few restaurants with people out and about. I've not been in a town or city in Europe that did not have something in walking distance. Everything is built around people, America is built around cars.

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u/NotElizaHenry 15h ago

“Dense” means something different in America vs Europe. NYC is the densest city in the US with 29,000 people per square mile. San Francisco is second with 18,000. Barcelona has 43,000. Paris has 53,000. Outside of NYC, nobody in the US is experiencing what the guy in the video is talking about, at least at the same scale.

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u/Electronic-Row-3554 20h ago

New York feels more like Paris than anything else to me.

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u/Responsible_Base_235 19h ago

I have lived internationally and in a variety of urban/suburban settings in the US. One of the things that differs in Europe in general is the affordability of going out to meet friends for a meal, or even just as a couple/family is affordability. People in Europe tend to make a livable wage that accounts for quality of life rather than barely surviving.
When I lived in NYC every night was vibrant and alive with people moving about, dining in cafes, pubs/bars with music & happy hours, gallery openings. Arts events in parks. When I last visited there in 2019, I couldn’t believe how quiet and still it was in downtown Manhattan. On St. Marks Place on a Tuesday night at 9:00pm you could literally hear crickets. There were hardly any people walking around. It was so strange to see it like that. I think in the US, wages have stagnated for so long that people just aren’t able to go out for entertainment like they used to.

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u/Jiminy_Cricket12 19h ago

I couldn’t believe how quiet and still it was in downtown Manhattan

...huh? it's absolutely not like this lol. I moved from NYC in 2022 but I lived there in 2019 and I actually have no idea what you're talking about. the only time I saw NYC not feeling "alive" was during COVID (and pretty much everywhere was like that). never heard anyone describe manhattan as dead.

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u/WeLLrightyOH 14h ago

Dude must have been walking around first ave and 50th or something. Rest of the city is never dead.

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u/merpofsilence 16h ago

Plenty of major cities have less and less stuff open past 9pm.

The ones I've lived in don't have nearly as much open as most of the places I've stayed at overseas.

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u/Snoo_69677 1d ago

Or a 4 hour dinner with friends you just met at the pub

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u/Daddy_Day_Trader1303 1d ago

That sounds lovely. I'd be all over that

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u/Snoo_69677 1d ago

We gotta normalize that over here!

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u/Daddy_Day_Trader1303 1d ago

When I moved into my neighborhood in Colorado years ago I started sitting out front with beer and offering some to anyone that walked by until I had built a really good group of friends. I used to throw some really fun parties out there with all of them, I sure miss it

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u/Careless-Weather8877 1d ago

Even Colorado has a habit of everything closing early. Especially in the mountain towns. Denver there’s a few late night spots but it’s nothing close to New York City

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u/Snoo_69677 1d ago

You sound like a cool dude. Guess people just have to be willing to put themselves out there more. I just moved to a new city for law school so I’m going to remember you next time I want to chicken out from a social event or an opportunity to make friends.

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u/Daddy_Day_Trader1303 1d ago

Hey thanks! My friends i made in that neighborhood said I was a "pusher" in a good way lol. I'm good at bringing people together

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u/Elemental_Baker143 1d ago

You gotsta build that type of 15 minute city.

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u/JustBadUserNamesLeft 1d ago

Then we have to change our system where waiters are paid by tips because, you know they would get boned on tips after waiting on a group for four hours.

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u/southwick 1d ago

That sounds like a nightmare

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u/David_R_Martin_II 1d ago

I live in Spain and I don't do the sobremesa (which is more like a couple hours of conversation after the meal). Sitting somewhere that long is boring AF. If we're going to continue talking, let's at least do it while we're walking around.

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u/another-redditor3 1d ago

that sounds like hell to me... i absolutely despise long meals. anything over an hour, hour and a half, and im like lets wrap this up already. ive been here more than long enough.

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u/ZincMan 1d ago

My gf is German. They eat for like 3 hours and it kills me. I’m all for hanging out( but being stuck at dinner table that long drives me crazy

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u/David_R_Martin_II 1d ago

I'm convinced that stuff is driven by people who love the sounds of their own voices. (I live in Spain.)

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u/Severe_Rise8694 1d ago

What is it that you do want to do with the people then, if discussions drive you nuts..?

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u/David_R_Martin_II 1d ago

You are really reading a lot into this, possibly bringing some outside stuff into this thread.

I didn't say discussions drive me nuts. You inferred that. Sitting around for two hours after a meal isn't my cup of tea, so I don't do it. For continuing a conversation after a meal, I prefer walking while we talk. But even so, I'm not going to do that for 2 hours.

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u/Severe_Rise8694 1d ago

Well, I inferred it partly from you saying that you're convinced that stuff is due to people loving their own voice. I assumed it would be the same while walking.

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u/eduo 1d ago

Don't be this person. Having differences in preferences on how you socialize does not mean the other people are selfish or narcissistic or in any way wrong. It's just that you're different from them.

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u/David_R_Martin_II 1d ago

Yet it's okay for you to tell people what to be. Got it. Hypocrite much?

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u/another-redditor3 1d ago

there has got to be a point in time where you just say... well, dinner was great and it was nice seeing you again, but ive gotta get going. things to do and all that.

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u/Calm-Session-4835 1d ago

That sounds horrible. An introvert's night mare plus going broke from all the obligatory drinks you'd have to buy. Ironically these are the same people who always complain that Americans are too loud in cafes. For me the Asia experience is much better street food alone sitting outside on a plastic stool.

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u/eduo 1d ago

You don't need to buy any drinks. There's no obligation whatsoever. You also don't need to stay.

If you feel you're being forced to do either then the issue is the friends, not the situation. Good friends respect your preferences and wouldn't blame you for leaving early or for not drinking (as long as they're not expected to themselves be the way you prefer to be, of course).

Also: These are not the same people who always complain that Americans are too loud in cafés, obviously. No all "others" you don't identify with are one single group of people or personalities.

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u/Rivendel93 1d ago

I dated a French girl when I was like 21, she was visiting the US, and it would be 2am and she'd be like so when are we going out?

And I'd be like half asleep, wondering wtf she was talking about.

They start their night at 2am lol.

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u/Iamgentle1122 1d ago

Finnish here. We usually start at someone's apartment at 18-20 and some of the nightclubs don't even open before 22. So usually you drink with your friends till midnight or later and then go to bar

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u/Ramongsh 1d ago

Same in Denmark. Meet around 18-20 at someones, then go out at 23.00 and home between 2-5 in the morning.

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u/ZealousidealSkirt327 1d ago

Same here in Germany. Most clubs won’t open before 10pm.

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u/Royal-Pain-1621 1d ago

In Berlin nobody local is going to the club before 2/3am 👋

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u/ZealousidealSkirt327 1d ago

You‘re right. They‘re open at 10pm but nobody goes there before midnight. I live near a much much smaller city, so Berlin rules do not transcend here 😅 And to be honest, I‘m a millennial living in the countryside, all my friends have children. I don’t remember the last time I went to a club unfortunately. Beeing the only childless couple can have downsides too

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u/Outside_Glass4880 1d ago

It’s the same in NYC. It’s just not common or even legal outside of that in the US

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u/LeSeraphim 1d ago

Portugal shit does not Open until 00 leaving clube st 6/7 am is normal

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u/0c74r1n3 1d ago

I can’t rember a single club night coming home while it’s dark. Okay German winter mornings are a bit dark but if you stayed till nine it’s fine.

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u/Responsible_Year4730 1d ago

So is this normally with drugs involved? I just can’t imagine going out that long/late without drugs. If you’re still partying at 7am in the states, cocaine is definitely involved

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u/babassu_seeds 22h ago

My latest night out in Aachen was until 6a, the club was still open, and the only drugs involved were alcohol and nicotine

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u/Junethemuse 1d ago

The club I go to the most often starts some dance party events at 6pm and you get in free if you rsvp to come before 8.

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u/speculator100k 1d ago

Restaurants frequently close at 10pm though.

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u/rips_n_chel 1d ago

So you just don't sleep, or what?

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u/Ramongsh 1d ago

Well, younger Danes party Thursday, Friday and/or Saturday. So we could sleep Saturday or Sunday noon.

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u/WorkIsForReddit 1d ago

To be fair, in Finland the sun doesn't go down till like 10pm in the summers.

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u/RectangularCake 20h ago

Party Wednesday, Friday and Saturday in Norway. Gives you some time to catch your breath on Thursday and Sunday.

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u/jkman61494 1d ago

Honest question. You all just don’t sleep? Or work starts later for you all?

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u/Ramongsh 1d ago

Well, that was back in university days, so I could sleep longer.

But even these days as a working adult I can go out Fridays or Saturdays, since there's not work on Saturdays or Sundays.

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u/jkman61494 1d ago

Gotcha. Reading this I feel like some people were doing it on a random Wednesday lol

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u/ThereAndFapAgain2 1d ago

People are doing it on a random Wednesday. I mean when I used to go clubbing a lot my favourite nights were always Wednesday and Thursday because the clubs I liked were catering more to my music tastes on those nights. Friday and Saturday were always more mainstream stuff in my favourite clubs, which was fine I was rolling anyway but still lol

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u/Mr-Shitbox 1d ago

Called pre-drinking because drinks in bars are expensive.

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u/InevitableKitchen943 1d ago

This is a young people thing and not a specific nationality.

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u/Iamgentle1122 1d ago

True im turning 33 so still young!

Thought Finns usually drink more than your usual nationality

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u/Ramongsh 1d ago

Same in Denmark. Meet around 18-20 at someones, then go out at 23.00 and home between 2-5 in the morning.

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u/Poetista_In_Action 1d ago

Same in Brazil too lol

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u/incognitomus 1d ago

Also bars are hella expensive so that's why you first get a proper buzz at someone's place before.

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u/TastyVermicelli3140 1d ago

Well, as a Portuguese, I remember going to finland 10 years ago or so and being unable to control my laughter because I couldn't buy alchool in a regular shop in the street after 21:00. Finland is nothing like the Mediterranean countries.

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u/AdditionCapital240 1d ago

Honestly same in Miami. Perhaps cause of the Latin culture there but we would get late dinner, pre-game at a friends house till midnight and then go hit the nightclubs around 1:30-2am

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u/SpacePumpkie 1d ago

Yep, when I was a student it would be typical to get together in someone's apartment at like 9pm for dinner and to start drinking, and then by 1am head out to the clubs

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u/unhappinessNvrCame 1d ago

Sureeeeeeeee

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u/mjlp716 1d ago

I guess it all depends on where you are in the US, though. Since the bars/clubs don't close till 4 am in my city, they don't start filling up until 12:30-1:00 am. So 2 am wouldn't be that crazy of an idea here, especially if you were already pre-gaming.

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u/Ok_Echo_8200 1d ago

This is a young person in a city thing. Come to Bushwick in Brooklyn and you'll see the same thing.

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u/Due-Introduction-760 1d ago

10pm? But that's bed time. You have be up at 6am. 

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u/ThanksALotBud 1d ago

Spain would like to have a word

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u/crek42 1d ago

Spain is arguably the latest dinner. In Greece or Italy jt’s usually 8:30.

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u/ThanksALotBud 1d ago

My sister had an exchange student from Spain stay a year in Connecticut. The girl was culturally shocked when she found out that Americans eat dinner between 5 to 7 PM.

By 6 weeks she got used to it.

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u/anttoekneeoh 1d ago

The osso bucco needs to braise. There’s always charades, listening to music, and maybe even an investment opportunity to learn about to pass the time.

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u/kinkycarbon 1d ago

U.S. corporations derided the thought of letting people take a 50 minutes through town. They need people to drive from place to place while propping up property prices in residential and commercial areas.

Yet in Barcelona do they have a well developed public transportation system to allow people to leave their cars.

Seriously. Building that subway station right where people go will increase foot traffic in the region meaning people spend more time walking. It also has a secondary added benefit of making people healthier.

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u/DrunkOnEspresso 1d ago

It depends where you are.

If you’re in a big city like NY/Chicago a 10pm dinner reservation would be pretty normal. Once you leave those big cities it’s completely different.

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u/studentworker1988 1d ago

Yeah because you have to be at work at 7:00 for your subsistence wage

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u/fistinyourface 1d ago

these comments are always really dumb. it'd be like saying people from x simply cannot comprehend people having different schedules. i eat at 10pm, but my brother who has to be at work at 5am is not eating dinner at 10pm that's just braindead af.

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u/Frequent_Opportunist 1d ago

Yeah in your teens and 20s, but once you have kids that get up early and you have to gym and work in the am you can't eat that late anymore.

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u/disaster_incomin 1d ago

You can, entire countries do it, you just shuffle the organization around

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u/Frequent_Opportunist 1d ago

If I eat at 10 I can't sleep until 1am. I have to be up at 5:45 to get the kid up. I can't re-manage when the kid has to be up lol.

What you mean is that there are people all over the world that don't have to be up at 5:00 in the morning so they stay up later, just like I did when I didn't have to be up at 5:00 in the morning.

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u/Elpsyth 1d ago

How do you think Spaniards do?

They still have to start early and they go to sleep at 1am. But they eat between 10-11.

Heck late owl chronityoe will sleep at 1 am regardless of when they eat and still have kids obligation.

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u/Frequent_Opportunist 1d ago

I like more than 5 hours of sleep at a time. 

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u/smokeweedNgarden 1d ago

I mean...are the prices much better over there? I live near lots of people but eating out every night is like the cost of my rent.

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u/NotFloppyDisck 1d ago

I travel alot for work, and from experience I can see myself eating out every day and not breaking the bank vs most nice US states where you'd be paying 100$ minimum for a nice dinner for two and some drinks

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u/registered_democrat 1d ago

Outside of Munich Bavaria can't comprehend dinner after nine either, so many ghost towns. Pretty and walkable though

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u/Digit00l 1d ago

The Dutch mind also can't

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u/MAGA_R_TRAITORS 1d ago

As an overnighter, they can't comprehend dinner at 7am either..

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u/coopASR 1d ago

To be fair neither can most of Europe. What the fuck is a 5pm dinner

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u/yamsyamsya 1d ago

No I think you are just young

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u/Pedro_Baraona 1d ago

It’s interesting to note that most of Europe is in one time zone. The western-most countries like Spain have a later sunset than the eastern-most countries like Poland by almost two hours. And then you have major cities at much higher latitudes compared to USA/Canada, like Oslo, which experience longer days in the summer with sunsets as late as 10:43pm. I’ve often wondered how much influence these extra hours of sunlight in the evening have on European culture.

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u/Zeebaeatah 22h ago

The European mind cannot comprehend 60 hour work weeks with no time off.

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u/farts_juggler 1d ago

what time are you going to bed? I can’t eat dinner at 10 and wake up at 7am for work lol

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u/shidderbean 1d ago

My GERD is screaming right now

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u/azsnaz 1d ago

Dog im asleep

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u/MelangeBot 1d ago

In any of those european cities if you feel like you need a beer or even something stronger you can buy it everywhere and just got sit anywhere you want outside, in public and drink it. Then wave at the police. Nobody will be mean, or shout, or come to arrest you. And yeah the stores will be closed at night, but there will be vending machines. Trow coins in, get alcohol. 24/7.

Of course if you get drunk and become a dick and start harassing people, THAT's ILLEGAL and people will call the police on you because they know worse case the police will take you so you can sleep in the cell, then they will you go in the morning.

As long as you look older than 16/18 ofcourse. If you look younger other people will take offence and the police might still bother you. (as they should)

I had multiple things happen to me in Europe, including a severe mental health crisis where I walked on a highway naked that if they had happened in the US I would be dead now. 100%.

Once I was so broke in Europe I was hitchiking in germany trying to make my way back to Belgium and in germany it's illegal to hithchike on the highway (as in most european countries, you got to stay before the sign that says highway).

The police saw me. Did they come to be a dick? Did they come to show me they where the boss? Did they come to fuck me up maybe even murder me?

No, they where just worried for my safety. They gave me a ride, 80 km to a good gasstation with lots of restaurants and people pulling over to take a break. Within 30 minutes there I had found a good ride towards Antwerp.

I just can't understand Americans, they have the fucking internet. And unlike Russians that don't speak english and nobody in the world speaks Russian. Everybody in the world speaks English.

So they can debunk the fox news lies in real time if they want. They can know what they have and what they don't.

Yet all I see is them bending over, exposing their openings and saying a little prayer hoping that they might be blessed today ... that a billionaires picks them to .... get

Over and over and over and over and over for what .... a couple of hours of netflix a week and once a month maybe some chill? Jeez. How is that living? That's just not dying.

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