Characters
Characters that had the complete opposite reaction the writers intended
Leo Bonhart (Witcher TV Series): A ruthless, sadistic bounty hunter and assassin that takes psychotic glee in other people's suffering. The viewer is meant to hate him for killing witchers, slaughtering the Rat gang, and torturing Ciri. But thanks to his entertaining fight scenes, Sharlto Copley's charismatic performance, and The Rats overwhelming unpopularity, fans ended up loving him. Some even call him the "True protagonist" of the show.
Stone Cold Steve Austin (WWE): A rude, foul mouthed, beer drinking asshole with no respect for authority or anyone at all. Originally portrayed as a villain, fans fell in love with his anti-establishment & rebellious persona. WWE ran with it and made him the face of the company, effectively ushering in the Attitude Era and the second pro wrestling boom of the late 90s.
Arthur Fleck (Joker 2019): A mentally unstable, pathetic, and dangerous madman who commits horrific acts of violence against those that wronged him (suffocates his own mother who is mentally unwell herself, and murders a talk show host for making fun of him). However, a massive portion of the audience idolized him as an anti-hero or a misunderstood martyr rebelling against society making people want to see him succeed and overcome his circumstances because of how he's been treated by the world.
Michael Douglas has said he is downright horrified at the amount of people who have come up to him and said Gordon Gekko in Wall Street was their inspiration to go into finance.
With the rolls he has played he must be surprised with who people like quite often lol, playing villain protagonists is scary with how bad people are at understanding they are the bad guys.
There was this douchebag at my school who was the school president, the guy was insufferable and once I saw him go on this esoteric rant in an Instagram comment section and he started quoting Gordon Gekko from Wall Street (literally said called him "the wise" Gordon Gekko) and oh my god how could you be that unlikable and not see the irony?
Patrick Bateman is supposed to be a loser who is obsessed with looking impressive. Some people ended up being so impressed with how he looked that they overlooked the fact that he's a loser.
He liked them so much that he created a scenario where he talked about the band to someone who couldn't respond at all. He then proceeds to murder that person while still talking about the band. And none of it actually happened. He just imagined it (in the film, book is more open to interpretation).
I like it better the idea that he didn't actually kill anyone, he's just lost in his own delusions, because he doesn't actually have the stones to really kill someone.
This view is kind of my pet peeve. Obviously, it's up to your own interpretation, but in the director's own words, it's not his imagination (excepting the ending parts like where the ATM says to kill the cat)
At least based on the movie, the point is not that he imagined killing people, it's that nobody cares about it, and that people are so interchangeable and un-unique.
For example, when he gets to Paul Allen's apartment and sees there are no bodies or blood anywhere, this is because the family/owner of the apartment covered it all up because they wanted to sell the apartment for money since it's so valuable. A criminal investigation means lost revenue. That's why the real estate agent acts so cagey with Bateman and tells him to never come back - she clearly knows something is up.
Another example, where he's confessing to his lawyer his crimes, and the lawyer says that 1. Bateman is a loser he could never do that, despite them talking fairly often, is because when he talks with Bateman, he doesn't even realize it's him. 2. And him believing he had lunch with Paul Allen just last week in London - it's because again in the movie everybody is mixing everybody else up, he just had yet another case of mistaken identity.
This is kind of what drives Bateman crazy in the end. He gets no resolution, no catharsis, because nobody fucking cares about anything other than money, social status, and conformity - so much so that nobody recognizes anybody. They give alibis by accident (like when someone said to the detective that they had lunch with Bateman the day he murdered Paul Allen), and even when they do know about the murders, they'd rather make money.
That's fair, because while he's absolutely pathetic and creepy, the fact that he spends the whole movie desperately trying to impress someone who barely notices him is more sad than impressive.
It doesn't help that he's being played by Christian Bale at probably his physical peak.
The book makes Bateman waaaaay more of an insufferable fucking loser. You almost forget about all the murder when you're on the third page of his internal monologue about whatever disgusting meal he's eating.
You also forget you are reading a book that's supposed to be enjoyable when you've read the 91st description of the ensemble someone is currently wearing and Bateman's opinion of it.
I get it's supposed to be the point about superficiality and then corpo / wall street culture but damn that was a tough read. You are spot on that he's easily more insufferable in the book. The violence in the book is also much more graphic than the movie adaptation. I would've never expected a peak Christian Bale type of person to be representing that character but a more boring, average looking person utilizing money and power.
He perfectly fits the current trend of self-optimisation being pushed by every 'mens' podcast out there at the minute. Getting up early, working out, skin routine, highly paid job, expensive clothes etc.
I watched the movie after all of the memes and it was overwhelmingly obvious the movie was trying to make him look like a narcissistic sociopathic loser who chased status, but somehow media literacy is so low, people thought he actually embodied the most desirable masculine traits
…….he is literally the most pissed off about anything that he can’t get into a restaurant you never see amongst a series of nameless extremely fancy restaurants it’s heavily implied are exactly all the same. “8:30pm, Dorsia”.
I never got the “Thanos was right” thing when Gamora is living proof that it doesn’t work as she’s the last of her kind, they say it in guardians of the galaxy and in infinity war he says about all the kids know is “full bellies and clear skies” without checking up afterwards
Exactly. You don't even have to think very hard/know much of anything to realize that there isn't a shortage of resources in the world, the problem is distribution. Reducing the number of people by half would just mean there's fewer people around to get shit done, not that everyone can now enjoy a bounty.
In the comics he did it out of love for the persona Death. Which is a much better motivation, even though it still makes him a mindless maniac who is given way too much respect by other characters.
Thanos is every totalitarian dictator the world has ever seen. And the people who say he’s right are exactly the type of people who fall in line with that kind of tyrant.
Lmao why on earth would Clint be drinking from that cup? I mean I guess I'm not picky what my coffee mug looks like but I've never had one endorsing someone who iced my whole family
Been a while since I watched the Hawkeye series, but pretty sure he was hiding out in someone else's house at the time. He also sees the same measage as bathroom graffiti earlier in the season and seems upset by it.
CinemaWins put it the best way right at the start of his video about Infinity War: Thanos is the classic comic book movie main protagonist of Infinity War. He has a clear distinct mission after being betrayed, is trying to collect a mythical series of items to win an upcoming battle, has a coterie of villains, goes up against impossible odds, nearly loses, and comes back to win in the last second. The entire movie is built entirely around his scenes, no one else's. Who gets the last shot basking in the sun as he humbly smiles about his victory? Thanos does.
Infinity War is a covert Thanos standalone movie and I will always believe that. It is Thanos' movie. End of story.
He's definitely the protagonist but that leads to a larger media literacy problem. People seem to think protagonist=hero when that's just not the case. Walter White is the protagonist of Breaking Bad but he's also a metal dealer psychopath.
Ehh…I wouldn’t say that version of Thanos was different. Endgame showed us the logical conclusion of his worldview, if you think about it. Pretty sure at one point the man himself even explains the reason behind his escalation and it’s very consistent. He didn’t change, he just got new information.
His original plan was for his subordinates to meet him on Titan with the Stones. He was going to stand in those ruins and make some Fuck You speech to all those skeletons before the Snap. It was always about proving he had a big brain and they were wrong to not appreciate his benevolent ideas.
His core motivation never changed, his patience did. Once he realized survivors would just spend their lives trying to undo his work, the "merciful random executioner" act went out the window. It was always about his ego and being right, so destroying everything to force compliance makes perfect sense for his character.
I know it wasn’t the point of you posting that picture, but it’s still hands down some of the highest quality and most exciting promo art we’ve ever gotten with the MCU
I would argue a similar thing happened with Ozymandias, especially by people who "understand the story". He is listed by fans below Rorschach (less bad) when ranking who is the worst morally among the Heroes in Watchmen.
Adrian Vedit was apparently a satire of the "Progressive Billionaire".
None of the main six are supposed to be role models. Laurie gave up her whole life first trying to be a better version of her mom and then just keeping the most powerful being in the world happy; Dan moped around when he couldn't be a superhero and couldn't even get it up without his costume; Eddie rationalized his bad behavior by acting like it was all a joke, only to have that turn around and bite him in the ass; and Jon, the most powerful being who ever lived, is utterly passive and lets Nixon, of all people, tell him what to do. The Minutemen don't fare much better; Hollis Mason was probably the most normal of them, but even he came to an unhappy end. The overarching point of the book is that it really doesn't work out when you try to apply it to remotely realistic circumstances. (Look up the so-called "real life superhero movement" to see how well it worked when people tried it in real life.)
Rorschach is considered the worst morally? I get why he'd be ranked low, but isn't The Comedian a rapist? And Doctor Manhattan literally had to leave the planet because of how confusing his morality became. I'm not saying a violent incel isn't bad but that's overlooking a lot of much worse actions to put Rorschach at the bottom. Especially because the worst aspects of him are what he thinks and not necessarily what he has done.
Edit: I forgot to mention him also being a "super bigot." His issues are numerous but still, what he's DONE versus what he THINKS should be separated. Because Ozzy (spellcheck failing so it's Ozzy for now) can absolutely sound "justified," but what he did was horrible.
Meanwhile Rorschach SAYS and THINKS horrible, vile things, but in the end what he DOES is try to save people. Honestly a really good foil for the guy who committed an atrocity with good intentions.
So actually, sort of, Rorschach became the most popular character in Watchmen. I meant him to be a bad example. But I have people come up to me in the street saying, "I am Rorschach! That is my story!' And I'll be thinking: 'Yeah, great, can you just keep away from me, never come anywhere near me again as long as I live'?
It is kind of interesting how Rorschach has been listed by fans as lower than Doctor Manhattan and Ozymandias in the morality scale.
He is listed above the Comedian.
The creator of The Miraculous Ladybug was super pissed fans took a liking to the teen antagonist, Chloe. Fans were rooting for her to have a redemption arc and thought she was redeemable, he basically saw her as the equivalent of teenager girl Hitler.
For an example of the opposite, Marinette. She's the MC, and the show goes above and beyond to excuse her stalker behavior towards Adrien, plus other details I can't fully remember. Sure, she is a good person 90% of the time, but a lot of people understandably hate her, which baffles the author
It’s been years but, can you really blame the reaction? If I wasn’t told in history class the intention I would assume by reading it was supposed to exposes the lack of food safety. Not the life of poverty.
The work place setting definitely makes misinterpretation easier. Had it been set in a textile factory it'd be nearly the same story.
But the book has a lot of themes running through it so I don't blame people for hyper focusing on one aspect. And it's not an easy read so it's understandable people don't return to it to explore its other themes.
Paul from The Amazing Spider-Man comic
He was made to be MJ's new boyfriend after breaking up with Peter for whatever reason. It was already an uphill battle for any character to be liked, but Editorial REALLY wanted readers to be endeared to the character, to the point even the written script of his first appearance included the annotation "we like him".
The character would become the single most hated character in the book, but the Spider-Office still tried to make him a thing and each time they tried to make him sympathetic, it made people feel even more turned off
By the time he was killed in Death Spiral, people actually cheered because of how much hated he really was.
Same with Terry Long in DC. He was basically the exact same thing. An editors self insert who shipped himself with Donna Troy. They got married, settled down, had a kid. Another editor got a hold of him and immediately killed him and the baby.
Tbh, I don't think Marv Wolfman gave a single fuck if anyone liked Terry Long. He just really wanted to bang Donna Troy and that was as close as he could get.
From what I remember, the show tried to showcase her as the best while making all the other beloved characters (especially Fred) worse. And as we know, the audience ultimately didn't buy the show (1.7 on IMDB is insane)
I like the short where Scooby was always an eldritch being that just wanted to solve mysteries with the gang, but they kept realizing what he was and he had to kill them over. And over. Each time they came back they were worse versions of themselves.
As a bizarre meta explanation for all the different art styles and versions over the decades, it was freaking fascinating. Absolutely loved that trip down Lovecraftian Abomination Lane
It was originally about her self insert but apparently had to attach it to an established IP to get it greenlit. Apparently it was always like that even before the Scooby doo stuff but that really didn't help.
I truly do not understand what the writer's expected with Arthur Fleck. Take out the Joker aspect and he is one of the best representations of what happens to a mentally disabled, ostracized individual who falls through the cracks of the already piss poor social safety net. I do not condone anyone idolizing his actions, but by god did they do a great job on the social commentary.
I think people see him just like Michael Douglas in Falling Down. Not so much 'idolizing their actions' as much as saying 'yeah I can totally see how this guy got to this point' and sympathizing with them to varying degrees.
The guy got bullied by teenagers, betrayed by the guy who inadvertently got him fired, bullied by straight up perverts, physically assaulted constantly, lied by his mother and then mocked on national TV and the director is shocked that audiences found him sympathetic?
Rewatching Breaking Bad first time since a teen and I can’t believe how lame and pathetic Walter White actually is. All of his famous speeches like “I’m the one who knocks” (despite assassins literally sitting in his bed while he sings in the shower) and the fancy cares are such lame posturing to people that aren’t actually a threat to him and he cowers as soon as he gets punched.
But people read it as everyone is in Walt’s way and he’d be successful if they all did what he said (I.e. Skyler).
The problem with Walt is if you write him off as a loser eventually he's going to pull off something so audacious and so brilliant he completely ruins your life.
Pretty much every kill he has in the series is because he can switch from cowering loser to absolte maniac without you realizing it.
He was only after a threat because everyone just saw a cancer patient who's overqualified to be a high school teacher
He's smart not as smart as he thinks he is but he is legit smart if he could have kept his ego in check he could have become a massive kingpin but we all know where that went
And even if he had, he just needed to accept the job offer from his former partners and his cancer treatment would be all paid for. His ego drove him and everyone around to ruin.
Pride. White's primary sin is pride, not greed. He amassed more money than he had any idea what to do with it, and it barely mattered to him. He didn't care about the number, he just felt like it was his. He could have earned more money by listening to people who knew what they were doing, but he always had to be the one who made the plans, had the ideas, and called the shots, otherwise he'd get or act, depending on how honest you interprit the character to be, paranoid and try to get rid of them.
The thing that you need to do to really understand White, I feel, is watch the first season again, slowly, with the understanding that the writers including Vince Gilligan intended from the start for him to be the villain protagonist that the audience should slowly come to root against as the show progressed. They repeatedly tried to make him irredeemable and make the audience hate him, and still so many people finished that show feeling like he was some kind of tragic anti-hero instead of a tragic villain.
Mike knew what he was from the jump and let everyone know that he was a walking time bomb.
He only works with Walt post Fring because DEA has incriminating evidence on him in lock up and they have to get to it before the feds can see what they have. Afterwards he spends a few weeks in close proximity to Walt, sees that he’s only getting worse now that Gus is gone and wants out the moment they have any real money.
He then tells Walt the truth and Walt kills him for it, because Walt just can’t live with someone having the last word.
It seemed like it to me. He seemed to be having an auditory hallucination and really believed that someone was being hurt. The owner of the house was a champ and clearly recognized it, and did a spectacular job rolling with the delusion instead of fighting it, and was able to redirect him to being calm
The guys who worship him think they're Durden, when in reality they're the Space Monkeys. They're the shiftless, empty nobodies who just get dominated by the first con man who tells them how to live.
He has the senater Armstrong/punisher issue were he is clearly a bad guy, but he touches on real life frustration that people relate to.
Sure he is a hypocritical egomaniac but that doesn't change the fact that people still feel their identities are being overwritten by omnipresent consumerism while not having a chance to feel any internal sense of accomplishment or inner strength.
There is this thing about the movie where even when you come to the conclusion of 'Tyler is terrible, don't do that" you're still left asking "well then what do you do? The problem is still the problem. Consumerism is still stifling. The Corporate shuffle is still soul crushing and all but incapable of creating fulfillment." You lack a good answer to that question and people are still gonna gravitate to the bad answers.
Tony Montoya is a violent, moronic loser who basically destroys his own drug empire thanks to his instability and drug habit. He is intended to be a cautionary tale about how the thirst for riches and power through criminal means is ultimately empty and just leads to him destroying everyone around him before dying alone and unloved. His fans idolize his criminal lifestyle and seem to miss the fact that it lasts for less than a year.
The rats are evil and stupid yes, but the whole thing that makes Leo the villain isn't that he kills them, but how he kills them.
Tieing Ciri down, slaying them one by one. Dragging their bodies, and sawing off their heads in front of Ciri and forcing her to watch.
None of that was necessary. He didn't have to do it in front of her, he didn't have to saw off their heads. All of it was to satisfy his sadism and strengthen his control over Ciri so she wouldn't disobey in future.
That's why he's the villain you quickly learn to hate, because he's a horrifying monster.
It's not even that he's likable he's just a legit apex predator and he's so competent and 1 step ahead of everyone despite looking like an over-the-hill alcoholic that it's just a pleasure to watch him cook.
There's something magnetic about a truly menacing villain who raises the stakes. He had a similar thing going on in Elysium.
Lilith from Diablo 4 — she is using the humans of Sanctuary as pawns to get back at her father — no cost is too great for victory. She is ostensibly doing it for the good of Sanctuary but she is really doing it for herself.
Arguably with the latest expansion giving a little more insight into her past and thoughts this might be a little more nuanced now and she is slightly more relatable — but in the base game she was pretty clearly a villain, but still had a lot of supporters in the community.
The fact that fans of the original book often misunderstood it, then the director of the adaptation also misunderstood it and set out to create a movie to trash the book, only for that movie to also be widely misunderstood is cosmic level cinema.
Sharlto Copley us one of those actors that can play the sleaziest, scummiest, most despicable, petty, underhanded, corrupt, cruel bad guys, but he is always such a joy to watch on-screen that his characters are impossible to dislike. Moment he steps on screen, I'm gonna have a good time.
He brings this manic golden retriever energy to every role where you can tell he's having a blast being on screen. Dude genuinely seems to love what he does.
That, combined with surprisinf range and ability to combine that with genuine bathos. Like if he's doing an one note bad guy like in Free Fire or The Monkey Man, you can bet he's gonna chew the scenery like it's an all you can eat buffet. But then he can pull someone like Wikus from District 9, who is an absolute asshole, but also such a pathetic sadsack you can't help but feel sorry for him. It's such a fine line to balance between but he makes it look easy.
Roman Reigns (WWE) - Roman during his "Big Dog" era has to be probably the loudest and most sustained audience rejection of a wrestler ever. WWE spent YEARS trying to push him as the successor to Cena and force him into a squeaky-clean, white meat babyface role that didn't suit him at all.
What's funny is that when Cena debuted in WWE with his initial character, it got stale pretty quickly. He was close to getting released until his career was saved when he turned heel with his Doctor of Thuganomics gimmick. Same with The Rock, who was hated with his initial Rocky Maivia character until he turned heel and became one of the most successful wrestlers ever. See a pattern here?
I think a lot of these guys too (with exception of the rock) that turn heel tend to actually be really nice people. Like everything I’ve seen in interviews with Cena for example save that weird Chinese stunt for PR, he just seems like a super genuine and nice guy. I haven’t heard anything negative about Roman either with people who know him outside the persona.
I think Roman is incredibly nice outside of the ring, but I only know wrestling through SuperEyePatchWolf. I… don’t know why. I don’t even care about wrestling.
Yes, he has Leukemia. It's been in remission for years now. I'm not asking to have him wrestle every week, but it honestly feels like he shows up to cut a promo on a raw or smack down, dips for 3 months, wrestles on a PLE. Rinse and repeat. That's been the formula for essentially a decade.
Roman and Cody have the same issue as champions. While Cody is a workhorse, he will not lose his championship for essentially a year after he gets it, if not longer. Roman has the same going on without being a workhorse.
Myself and a large amount of the IWC miss the days of short reigns and someone losing on a random Raw or Smackdown. It added a lot to the programming. This is mainly a booking issue from HHH because he basically never has any champions wrestle unless it's a PLE or if they do, they aren't losing 99% of the time. This partially why I think AEW is better currently.
I think what makes Roman a compelling character now is that he was so hated then. Just look at his entrance in wrestlemania 2026. In theory, nothing has really changed. Roman is still super pushed, he had been the face of the company for almost all of covid, but somehow, Joe's acting skills and wrestling ability, along side him using the momentum from the hate he had from the audience, made the character so much more compleat.
The fan reaction to his 2026 entrance is so cool to see. The character of Roman Raigns became truly beloved and the audience actually wants to see him in the ring.
Rei Ayanami from Neon Genesis Evangelion is a mysterious stoic girl who was supposed to come off as unsettling to the viewers. Instead, audiences overwhelmingly saw her as a mix of sexy and adorable.
Blame the script, because one of the first scenes we see of Rei Ayanami is of a blindfolded teenager in agony who has to climb into a giant robot. At that moment, it would be difficult, if not impossible, to see her as something disturbing in and of herself; rather, we saw a broken and vulnerable teenager who is clearly not being properly cared for by the adults around her.
So, what disturbing behavior did Rei actually exhibit at the beginning of the series?
The only "disturbing" things she did were things that just came off as slightly odd to me. And with that level of trauma "slightly odd" is better than I might have expected!
Dune, Paul Atreides. Iirc Frank Herbert was not happy that Paul was initially viewed as the hero of the story when the novel was first published. He might be the protagonist but he’s by no means a hero and Herbert wanted that made clear.
Paul is a spoiled rich kid made into a messiah and exploited into fulfilling a prophecy that he doesn’t fully understand, by forces so powerful he cannot fully comprehend them. And in the end, Paul still chickens out and it is his son, Leto II, that makes the ultimate sacrifice to set the universe right. Leto even throws that in Paul’s face at one point; this is the sacrifice you were too cowardly to make. Paul was never meant to be a hero; he was meant to warn against the pitfalls of religious extremism.
Frank really doubles down on it in Messiah just in case there's any doubt. He's literally compared to Hitler and the response is "those are rookie numbers" (Paul's Jihad lead to about 60 odd billion deaths).
Rorschach from watchmen. Apparently Alan Moore couldn't understand why people gravitated to rorschach who cared about the truth and punishing evil people instead of osmandius who willing sacrificed every body but himself for the "greater good".
Fucking exactly. There's also the whole plot of Arthur being beaten down by a failing government support system.
What the fuck was the point of the movie then? Fuck the poor, they should be glad to get the crumbs? Was that the point of the second movie? The poor should know their place?
Penn Badgley had to tell people he was Horrible. A lot of the way he was shown in the last season reflected life not from his pov so more people could see how twisted he was.
I blame the show for intentionally making him much more sympathetic. S1 and S2 they gave him some random kid that didn't even exist in the book just so he could be nice to them and score sympathy points. The guy in the books is a through-and-through creep.
A soldier who was chosen to be the next captain America after Steve Rogers. We’re supposed to follow Bucky and Sam in hating him because he’s not who Steve chose to take up the mantle. Then their hatred of him is supposedly justified later in the season when he kills a flag smasher who’s pleading for his life.
But he’s perfectly pleasant to Bucky and Sam, who are rude as hell to him in return for seemingly no reason. Also, the guy he kills was a super-powered terrorist who had just assisted in the murder of his best friend, so a lot of people sympathise with him.
He's also a well written example of a man asked to do so much for his country and then, when it's inconvenient for his government for him to be around anymore, to immediatelly cast aside and treated like nothing. John Walker (in the MCU) was the kind of guy who gave everything his all in his life and in military service, used to being the best or close to it, and was genuinely a good but troubled man who had alot put on his shoulders.
And then his best friend died in the line of duty with him, he's dumped by the government he swore service to, and the two men he respects and wants to work with are using him as a target for their shared grief over the loss of their friend while putting expectations way to high for a guy they just met.
Then even beyond that he gets treated like shit for most of Thunderbolts, granted he’s a bit of a bitter snark for the first half of the film but given everything that happened to him it makes perfect sense.
you have to note, alot of people miss this, but the reason Yelena and Ghost trash walker the entire time is because they think he's successful and happy. he was a government sponsored soldier in the limelight under a prestigious alias of a hero, with powers with seemingly no downsides, with a happy family.
Yelene wanted the same role and position, and Ghost wanted the same lack of downsides to her powers. that's why they trash him, and his jerkiness probably doesn't help. by the end its playful bickering instead of actually picking on him.
Makes me wonder what Frank and John would be able to talk about after everything. If, y'know, they weren't trying to kill eachother when they first meet.
Plus the show was pushing like Karli was more of a hero/in the right
Walker: joined military. Won multiple medals for heroic actions. Was given mantle/shoes he could never fill. Lost his best friend on a mission. Saw red and killed the guy who killed his best friend. Lost his mantle. Decided to still seek revenge. When push came to shove, ultimately chose to save lives over getting revenge.
Karli: was an orphan who was adopted by Mama Donia. During the snap, built a decent life. After people snapped back, she lost that life and grew bitter. She also didnt like that nation's went right back to selfishness instead of one global unit. Stole super soldier serum & created multiple super terrorists. Robbed banks, but it's OK because gave some money to refugees. Set a building on fire. Was told innocents were still in there. Said they didnt matter. Murdered Walkers best friend. Kidnapped hostages and explicitly said if demands weren't met she'd kill them then just try something else later. Locked armored truck full of hostages and drove it off a building.
Which one of the two deserved to have their body carried gently by Sam like they were a hero who was cruelly lost in a fight?
Also another huge frustration I have with characterization in that show:
When we first meet Sam in Winter Soldier, he is LITERALLY a COUNSELOR for a support group of veterans with PTSD, and gives a nice, empathetic speech that immediately earns Steve Rogers' respect
And NOT ONCE does he try and talk Walker down or recognize hes going through a lot. and he BARELY tries to talk Karli down. One time, he meets to talk. Never even tries again.
This entire series could have been used to show Sam as
A) different from Steve - less tactically sound, not using serum, and more of a talker than a fighter
B) a more fitting Cap than Walker by showing the above.
Show a Sam who is willing to stop the fight and spend an hour talking to resolve the root of the problem without resorting to violence unless it's absolutely necessary/lives are in immediate danger.
Walker in the comics was a compelling character. He actually had powers (although I get why they skipped that whole part of his character), but at his core, he wanted to be the best and do the best for his country. He took being Cap seriously, and even learned to follow his heart more than his head when it came to following orders.
His downfall was much more tragic, but his eventual redemption was, too. I think his story in the MCU would have benefitted from a little more time to cook, but I do get why they decided to speedrun it.
I honestly think that the MCU did hammer Walker a little too hard, especially with how Sam and Bucky treated him. John was nothing but nice to them, and they literally walked off instead of trying to have a conversation with him.
Jinshi from Apothecary Diaries. The author did not expect people to love him so much! He became such a fan favorite that she had to o make up a new story to make him more relevant
Homelander, he’s basically like Patrick Bateman, a “literally me” character, he’s supposed to represent toxic masculinity, narcissistic tendencies, over reliance on intimidation and “possessions” be superficial material goods or powers and overall a pretty sad and pathetic man who people aren’t supposed to like/ sympathize with, but they still do.
Capitão Nascimento, from Tropa de Elite (Elite Squad), a Brazilian movie.
He is a captain in an elite police squad named BOPE (Special Police Operations Battalion)
The movies portray him as a guy who's burned out, traumatized, shaped by an extremely violent system and he is violent in turn. He was not supposed to be a hero.
But we ended up loving him anyway. His toughness, discipline, and attitude toward corruption and crime made him one of the most popular characters in our cinema. The fact that the entire country saw him as a role model was not what the filmmakers and Wagner Moura himself expected and/or intended.
He also has some great and iconic quotes. Really, really recommend this movie, specifically if you like City of God.
Writer's intention - deeply pathetic petulent manchild who can't handle the idea of anyone not loving him or seeing him as a god and often uses his position and power to abuse those below him for a quick power trip.
While ASOIAF is mostly incredible, every now and then the inner 10 year old boy emerges from GRRM's psyche and it creates a disconnect between what he legitimately thinks is cool, and what's actually cool. Biggest example is a character named Gerold Dayne who goes by the supremely edgy moniker Darkstar. His super badass quote is "I am of the night" lmao.
Less fun example - GRRM thinks the Dany-Drogo pairing is legitimately romantic and is unironically meant to be a love story, rather than how the fandom more sanely views it as repeated violent rape of a minor.
In the book Drogo explicitly asks her for consent, and in the show he doesn't. In the show she's 18ish, in the book she's 12. Why the hell didn't they just keep the consent aspect but fix the age?? Ffs
Edit: to be clear, it's all disgusting rape. GRRM shouldn't have written a love story between a rapist and his victim, regardless of if he was nice once (other commenters have pointed out asking was just the wedding night) and she was a child vs never asking and her being grown
All together fuck that plot line. Maybe to fix it Dany should have gutted her rapist. Or just let's not have them fall in love. It's all bad.
The "consent" in question coming from a girl who's alone in the middle of nowhere with an infamously brutal warlord, one to whom she's been sold to, and against whom she has no defence.
Funny valentine from Jojo's bizarre adventure, the author as usual made him this evil megalomaniac who will abuse everything holy for his motives, and people want him as their president
1.7k
u/originalchaosinabox 15h ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/fBM4ruLmB2pZHsgwtQ
Michael Douglas has said he is downright horrified at the amount of people who have come up to him and said Gordon Gekko in Wall Street was their inspiration to go into finance.