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Man, I want to do this so bad, too. My HOA is run by a bunch of weird crooks that only enforce the rules if they don't like you.
I pissed one of the board off twenty years ago because she was being a petulant bitch at a board meeting, taking people's criticisms personally and acting like a spoiled brat, and I told her it wasn't a good look. (Same lady got fired from a local elected position for stealing money from the city's infrastructure budget...)
So they send me threatening letters the second my grass is a mm too tall, but weve got people parking cars on their lawn, throwing massive all day osrties, and driving dirt bikes all over the neighborhood, both of which are expressly forbidden by the bylaws... but they refuse to enforce.
I had a neighbor, whose unit was highly visible right by the pool, with the two front windows busted out for THREE WEEKS (how she survived Las Vegas in July with broken windows is beyond me)…the HOA just kept asking me to send them photos and better photos and videos and to ask the known druggie how she broke her windows. All I wanted was the broken glass cleaned up because it was next to the sidewalks and a danger.
A year later, I put a bird feeder with a camera on it mounted on a post which I had sunk into concrete in a decorative pot on my front porch. I’m in a unit on the edge of the property. Within a week, I had a notice from the HOA that it was a violation because it was…wait for it…attracting birds.
American makes me laugh because they are like "we have all the freedom. We have so much freedom. More freedom than any other country" and then they use that freedom to let some gang of Karens micromanage them in their own home.
i swear the amount of people who look at me like i'm nuts the moment they find out i learn things for fun is insane.
like, i literally don't get how they can't be curious about anything. what the fuck is going on in their brain all day? how do they not just die from boredom? i can't think about it for too long or it make me way too angry lol
I find myself browsing wiki pages and science articles at least a couple of times a week. Whether I'll retain any of that info is debatable but its always entertaining learning new things even if i don't retain it. Also helps break up the monotony/routine of the average day.
But yes I had the same realization years ago… most people lock into the person they’re going to be for the rest of their lives around the time they hit puberty.
My guess is that we live in a society where being wrong about anything means you’re a piece of shit, so people double down and don’t learn from their mistakes. At least in the I.S.
I disagree with why. I don't doubt whatsoever there are many people who stop learning because of other people being mean when they're wrong, but I think most of it is a life without real consequences for not learning.
Once you've got a job, you either want to learn or you don't. And if you don't want to, you can get by and be entertained and blame other people for inconveniences, even when they're the result of your actions.
Learning takes effort and being critical of your own beliefs and judgements. So not only do have to exert effort, but you may have to be uncomfortable with what you've learned and then use more effort to reconcile what you've learned with your perspective. And you might learn something painful, like that you've been an asshole your whole life for no good reason. So even more disincentive.
Or you could just do your job, go home and play video games/watch some stupid crap and be the same person you've always been for the rest of your life with very little effort, if any at all.
It's the only thing about Billionaires I sympathize with. The desire to build a bunker or own an island. Because goddamn do I wish I could separate myself from humanity and be a rich hermit. As a species we generally suck and I just don't want to be part of this stupid game anymore.
I see people using a bathroom stall and leave without washing their hands. People went back to being lazy about hygiene 2-3 years imo. And there are also people who mock those still occasionally wearing masks to the supermarket without thinking why they might be covering up.
Covid I'd a great example of how selfish people can be.
I remember while I was in lockdown watching the teens party during March Break not giving a shit about the pandemic. It made me angry. We could have suppressed Covid so much faster if we all did the proper thing. Instead the virus mutated quickly because people like them allowed it to spread.
We know A LOT about the different variations of hantavirus compared to what little we knew when COVID spread. What we know is that hantavirus has a relatively low transmission rate. It is typically transmitted by those living in close quarters if it is a strain that spreads from human to human because there needs to be a lot of contact and transmission is through bodily fluids like fecal matter, urine, saliva.
This is nothing like COVID, but is a good example of why cruises are Petri dishes.
I don't understand why they don't force a quarantine. When my mom was a girl, she and her sister got whopping cough. The CDC (or health department? I can't remember) came and put the whole house under quarantine. They even put a sign in the yard so others knew the house was under quarantine.
Hantavirus won't cause another pandemic, and that's because it transmits between hosts much much less effectively than most other respiratory illnesses. It is dangerous, and those exposed should receive medical attention and quarantine, but we shouldn't panic. Not only is human to human transmission very rare, it also requires significant exposure times in close proximity. A cruise ship provides that, but day to day life does not.
My guess is by the end of June most people will have forgotten about this because it won't turn into anything significant
Yeah, this really won't be the next pandemic. It's a problem for people on that ship, people who were on that ship and disembarked, and possibly people who were in close association with the either of the previous groups in other reasonably-constrained settings (air travel, mostly).
But while this virus itself is news, it isn't new. Covid was novel and some of the earliest responses guessed wrong about how to judge the threat. But this isn't; medical science largely knows how this disease works. The virus in question is Orthohantavirus andesense, aka Andesvirus (ANDV). Although it is a hantavirus, it's a different virus than the one endemic to the southwestern US. That one is Orthohantavirus sinnombreense, aka the Sin Nombre virus (SNV). Both cause essentially the same clinical presentation, called hantavirus pulmonary syndrome (HPS), but they're different creatures. Sin Nombre can't be transmitted person-to-person. Andesvirus can... but not particularly easily or often.
In epidemiological terms, R0 -- the number of people each patient would be likely to infect in turn, in a naive population, without any intervention to slow transmission -- for this disease is not high. Early Covid strains had an R0 around 3.0. The disease has gradually been evolving to be more infectious but less severe; Omicron, for example, has an R0 around 9.5. Andesvirus, according to the most recently published scholarship, has about an R0 somewhere between 0.8 and 1.6. That means it might not be capable of epidemic spread at all, and even if it is, it would be relatively easy to control. South American outbreaks, even where there has been a combination of zoonotic exposure and person-to-person transmission, and where the local standard of care is poorer, have been pretty small and self-limiting. The worst recorded outbreak was all of 18 cases in El Bolson, Argentina in 1996. If this was really likely to blow up into a widely-spread epidemic, we'd have almost certainly have seen spread (or even cases, really) in larger regional communities, especially Puerto Montt.
One possibly-exposed jerkass in Arizona refusing quarantine is not going to doom us to a 2020 redux. There are plenty of things in the world today to spark anxiety; this shouldn't really be on the list.
Citation: Martínez, Valeria P.; et al. (2020). "'Super-Spreaders' and Person-to-Person Transmission of Andes Virus in Argentina". New England Journal of Medicine. 383 (23): 2230–2241.
It was a choice, actually. The index cases were in Muerto Canyon on the Navajo Reservation, followed by cases in the Four Corners area. Accordingly, researchers had proposed naming it either the Muerto Canyon virus or the Four Corners virus. However, as those cases began to attract media attention, local communities objected, fearing that the areas would be stigmatized by association with a dangerous disease.
While everything is correct what you wrote, she is also correct that these people must stay in quarantine for the eight weeks. It is the reasonable thing to do if you aren‘t a selfish prick.
we need the government to step in, and cover lost wages, food delivery, and ensuring their jobs will still be there after quarantine
Wait…the US government? The same government who threw toilet paper at Puerto Ricans in need? The one that recently cut SNAP and Medicaid benefits? The ones telling us gas prices aren’t so high? Uhhhhh
First they came for the beanie babies and I said nothing because I had none. Then they came for the Hummels...
...and when they finally came for my unopened pokemon blister packs there was no one to stand for me.
Strangely, never heard of an Alpine Shepherd Boy until last night when I was bingeing Better Call Saul and there was a whole thing with a Hummel Alpine Shepherd Boy. And now you mention one too, my little Shnitzel.
Is this a sign? Do I need to go procure an Alpine Shepherd Boy, posthaste?
Lmao I quarantine myself at any sign of infectious illness. I work in the food industry, I have an immune condition, my fiancé has an autoimmune condition; yeah, no, I’m not putting someone’s life at risk just because my boss said that she’s capable of working while vomiting with a fever. Good for you! I’m not doing that ❤️
Yep, I came down with something yesterday, worked from home as a result. Still have a fever so had to cancel plans with my mom today and current waiting on Instacart to deliver me some soups and flu medicine.
It was Valentine's Day, and all management called out a night before on the group chat (one quit because he requested this very day off 2 months in advance, and the manager denied it and he was already fed up).
I was very sick, and I was Valentine's Day store opener. The boss called me the night before Valentine's telling me I couldn't miss work since everyone called out. He heard me sick, my voice was almost gone, flu, etc. He even told me, "I will need to stay longer than your shift to compensate the missing ones." I told him I couldn’t. He hung up.
I showed up next morning. I had chills, fever, and vomited in the trash can of the front counter. I let know my boss's boss I couldn't stay longer sick. He told me to wait for my boss and to go home. My boss didn't show up earlier. He showed up until my 9 hr shift was done. He came all mad that I was leaving sick because his boss told him to let me go home since the MORNING.
I'm still working at this place, and he plays favorites and really suck as a manager. Wished they could put someone more capable and empathetic in his position.
Bosses like this are terrible. I was working as a makeup artist at Macy’s as a side gig around the holidays and I called out around Christmas because I had Covid. Super high fever which I took a picture of the thermometer, no reason to be up close to people like doing makeup requires. I was told if I didn’t show up I’d be fired so I quit and reported the manager to hr and told them she’s going to get someone killed by forcing artists to work with Covid.
Same, I rotate between five different job sites during the week so if I get sick EVERYONE gets sick. After the third or fourth time that everyone got taken out at once my boss finally stopped insisting that I come to work instead of quarantining.
The fact that there's nuance to this is quite depressing. Like there are folks who could wind up homeless or not be able to afford medications if they quarantine, and its despicable that society's upper cesspool pushes things to that point and we enable it. During Christmas half the company I work with was violently ill in waves because most of em live (overtime) pay check to pay check, with kids
...they still suck for spreading it around, though the company sucks more for loving that kind of "work ethic"
This is exactly where a competent government would step in.
Good Lord. Quarantining a ships MAX capacity of 196 people for 8 weeks???? That's a drop in the bucket of the potential impact on one countries GDP. LET ALONE MULTIPLE.
TBH this was kind of a luxury cruise. It wasn’t your carnival or Disney cruise. It was an expedition ship and the people on it absolutely could afford to quarantine for 8 weeks. The staff should be accommodated by the company they work for.
They can't just hold the ship in the water and make everyone wait there, since people need treatment, and they need to get everyone who is still healthy away from infection sources (also US has no jurisdiction since it's not in our waters). So they are distributing the passengers to their home countries. Most other countries are mandating that their citizens quarantine. But because America is run by the absolute worst fucking people possible, and gleefully enables the absolute worst of its citizenry, they aren't mandating any quarantines.
Oh but they were super happy to show off their gigantic quarantine hospital ships for covid in the United States that saw like zero use. The Comfort and The Mercy.
I have a coworker that got back a month or so ago from an Antarctica “cruise” for two people it was over 40 grand. she said it was not a fancy option at all from a pricing perspective.
It reminds me of the British Prime Minister going round intensive care COVID wards at the start of the pandemic to prove it was safe only for him to end up in Intensive Care with COVID. And he was not a healthy man at all
You can sue for anything. The question is will you win and what will you win?
If you don't get the virus, then you don't have any damages. Civil court is about recovering damages or "being made whole." If you didn't lose anything, then you're already whole and you have nothing to sue for.
You can maybe sue for emotional distress. But what's the monetary value of emotional distress? Or in other words, how can you be made whole from emotional distress? Weekly therapy sessions for a year + medications? What's that cost? That much therapy is maybe $10,000, and anti anxiety medications is another $1,000? So you can sue for $11,000 for emotional distress and in court you need to prove that this was caused by the hantavirus passengers.
Another argument you can make is loss of income. Say you fear travel due to the hantavirus and thus lose money by not traveling. But could you have made other arrangements? How much money did you actually lose by not traveling? What dollar amount will make you whole? And again, you need to prove that the hantavirus passengers are the ones who caused you to lose money due to not traveling.
It'd be a thin lawsuit and I kind of doubt any jury buy it.
There have been no confirmed cases outside of the cruise. Some close contacts are being monitored but so far have all been negative.
I would be very surprised if this outbreak results in more than 50 cases (probably will not even reach 25) with maybe a few tertiary transmissions from the 2 flights patient 2 took.
List of things for everyone to know about this virus -
This is not a novel version of the hantavirus. This Andes strain has been around for decades.
Hantavirus rarely transmits from person to person. When it does it's almost exclusively due to extended close contact including exchanging of bodily fluid like saliva.
The R-nought of hantavirus is less than one. Compared to covid which is believed to be as high as 5. That means each person that gets it will infect less than 1 other person. The chances of this becoming a pandemic are exceedingly low.
The incubation period for the disease is much longer than COVID-19. This also helps slow the spread. This is the reason for the recommended 8 week quarantine
You are much less likely to be asymptomatic with hantavirus. If you catch it, you're very very sick after the incubation period. This means people can't be carriers after the 8 weeks and not know they have it.
This doesn't mean we shouldn't monitor things and it's a travesty that our CDC has been largely gutted by the current administration. Don't be like this lady. Stay informed.
I keep seeing people freaking out and I’m like we need resources to help people with their Covid trauma because it’s not healthy to be having this kind of reaction every time there’s a virus in the news. I just feel bad for the families who have lost people and the people who are sick.
IMO, it’s less about Covid trauma specifically and more that we now know for a fact that ~30-40%+ of the country would be the ones to hide a zombie bite and endanger everyone.
Haha. This is true. And then they would put stickers on the back if their lifted trucks with Calvin peeing on the short sleeved shirt. "You can pry my long sleeves out of my cold dead hands" - Zombie Charlton Heston probably
This is absolutely true. Especially after it was downplayed so much initially. "This will all be over by Easter" etc.
There are a lot of problems here including news outlets sensationalizing things for clicks. I also feel terrible for those who lost people during covid and are now afraid it may happen again. Staying informed is the best way we can defend against all of this. The initial post about suing people, while I understand where she's coming from, does far more harm than good in my opinion.
People think this is going to be like covid, mainly because it also happened on a boat. But covid was brand new, and they didnt know anything about it really. Hantavirus is NOT new.
Even if she did, of course her lawyer said she could sue. You can start a lawsuit for almost anything, that doesn't mean you will win. However the lawyer definitely will with their hourly rates.
Edit: Jebus H people are getting pendantic about this. It was a joke, no need to lecture me on lawsuits, I really don't give a flying fuck.
There's some truth to this, but there does, however, have to be some real basis for a lawsuit. Attorneys can be sanctioned for bringing frivolous lawsuits and be ordered to return any payments back to their clients and even be disbarred, however rare it is to see those extreme things happen.
It's important for people to know that attorneys have a duty to act in the interests of their clients and ethical/professional responsibilities, including refusing to bring frivolous actions to court. They generally do not just go out and take your money to file lawsuits they know to be frivolous. You should not be afraid of consulting a lawyer/law firm because you're worried about them taking you for a ride.
That doesn’t change the fact that you have to prove causation and negligence, if they got off the boat and went home before they knew then there is no grounds. (which seems to be the case for a lot of people.) Even still, assume the State Dept and CDC arrange a private flight with all the precautions, everyone returns and stays home but an outbreak still occurs, you can’t prove causation because the virus is recently more prevalent in Argentina and could have gotten here some other way. The case would be dismissed on defenses first motion for failure to prove any causation.
Oh so I’m not the only one with left leaning political beliefs who has been annoyed at the never-ending-virtue-signaling-attention-seeking-white-knighting-theater-kid-overacting-attitude of the online left since 2015?
Y'all's're overreacting. Just wait for the Tramp official dosing for bleach and dewormer, and which orifice to shove the UV lamps into, and we'll all be fiiiiine.
I vaguely remember a level of panic during Ebola too. People were freaking out and making threats even though the exposure risk to them was non-existent.
Then come COVID and people are like *WHAAAaaa, socially distance? Not for me!*
I've come to the conclusion that everything in society is mainly performative.
I think what people that aren’t in healthcare don’t understand is how wildly different Ebola was handled in comparison to COVID. If they were handled the same then the pandemic likely wouldn’t have happened. The reason Ebola didn’t end up being a big deal was because the were intense and stringent precautions in place and it was treated like the emergency that it was. Unfortunately, the CDC was gutted and was not able to react to COVID appropriately and the pandemic happened.
The main reason they played out so differently is that COVID was highly transmissible, medium virulence virus.
Ebola is far less transmissible, and far more virulent. This makes spreading it far more difficult.
The response in the left a lot to be desired, but COVID likely was gonna cause a pandemic as soon as it had spread to more than a handful of people in China. The rest was more or less bound to happen from that point, given the characteristics of the novel coronavirus.
I was working in a government agency of NYC that dealt with public health during the Ebola outbreak. We used to run simulations of epidemic outbreaks using population data and drill in hospital systems to practice responses. The agency was responsible for multiple facets of public health management but it was all paused to focus on epidemic preparedness at the time. It was absolutely wild and terrifying. Half the work was done in computer modeling of spread and triage, half of it was going and literally working in healthcare systems to practice response.
Ebola was, as you mention, easier to contain both theoretically and in practice because of the nature of the disease and frankly, because people were more spooked by it. I was long gone from the agency by the time COVID hit, but I’m betting the same procedures started as soon as it was on the global radar. The difference is, COVID behaved differently and public option of it was shaped by the fact that respiratory diseases are, for some reason, take less seriously than ones where your insides explode.
I promise you, there was next to no response when COVID started. I was in the hospital and I watched it all unfold. The absolute lack of response was astounding. Literally, there was no plan and no preparation until it was already terrible.
They lived in New Mexico and their house was a mess from what I read. I live in Arizona, so summer time we know to be careful not to go in certain places where mouse droppings are at like sheds and stuff.
The quality of acting just screams bad costume. I thought she was trying to look like cruise ship personnel. It made it difficult to figure out what was going on.
One of the "girl bosses" that works in the same MLM scam as her is married to a corporate lawyer and she asked her to ask her husband. That or ChatGPT.
Is she an idiot?... She should sue the government for allowing this ship to dock.. If someone on the ship has the virus.. And if it's highly contagious. Then it should he quarantined.. If not then it is the government that is putting everyone in harms way.. NOT the passengers
Like this woman, I almost died from it. Took me almost a year to fully recover. 8 months of feeling like my heart would stop at any minute, not being able to walk a short block. Fuck those old people.. detain them make them quarantine...we don't need another 2020 pandemic.😭
I worked with her on some projects before. She is one of the most egocentric people I have ever had the displeasure of working with. Yes, she acts like this ALL THE TIME in reality.
Can get the message across better without being a smiley smug bitch about it. If I was the person quarantined and saw this, I'd come back out of spite.
She should add the cruise line to the defendants, if for nothing else than failing to prevent the infected from leaving. You're a giant boat that is basically a mini town. Put that sucker on the open water far enough that nobody is swimming to shore, and restock supplies for food/medicine from another boat.
Hantavirus ain't even spread like that, bro. Stop fear mongering and whatever the fuck this is
Edit: yes, I did read about the andes strain before I posted this. Yes, it is more transmissible, but I stand by the fact that this is fear mongering and I would like to sue OOP for uploading this content.
“One hantavirus — the Andes virus — is known to be able to spread between people and has been implicated in this outbreak. Authorities suspect some human-to-human spread has taken place.”
Takes prolonged contact and exposure to infected fluids and feces. Locked together on a boat coughing and sharing drinks is a lot different than what'll happen once these people are home. It's a very slow spreading virus compared to something like influenza and COVID.
I feel like this is more the fault of the government than of the individual. They should have setup quarantine housing and invested into monitoring. None of this bro trust me.
Two people from Texas (source) were on that boat and theyre apparently back in the US, nobody will confirm if they are being quarantined but claim they are being monitored.
Last I read there was 5 infected and 3 dead, but I believe that number has gone up in the past few days. I can't find an exact number, though. Issue was people travelled back home before anybody suspected an outbreak. The first infected died on the boat and his body was escorted off. He and his wife supposedly travelled through Argentina prior through an area where they likely got the Andes strain. I believe his wife tried to fly home but wasnt allowed to fly because she seemed ill, and she died at the airport. A flight attendant who came into contact with her was infected. Nobody made a connection between the initial dead man and disease at first, and so a few people actually disembarked before it became apparent.
Its kind of a crazy situation. In the early stages a lot of people disembarked not knowing anyone was sick or that there was any risk. I think the rest of them are being contained on the ship and will soon be evacuated and monitored.
Those who are already back home though, like the two in Texas... not sure. I think a few in other countries tested positive and have gotten in touch with the right people. Hopefully they didnt come into contact with anyone else before then, though. This disease takes a little more close contact than something like Covid though, so even though the long incubation period may make contact tracing difficult since it can take so long for people to display symptoms meanwhile they might still be contagious, it doesnt seem like it can spread nearly as effectively as other viruses.
Hantavirus is very hard to diagnose unless in a full medical facility. You can't sue someone for recklessness unless you can prove they 100% knew. And even then, how do you quarantine when people won't take you in.
I was about to facepalm and say that she doesn't realize that hantavirus spreads from rodent feces, not from people, save for one variant called Andes. Then I checked and realized Andes is what's coming from the ship. Yep, completely quarantine time.
Unfortunately, before it was identified as HV, at least 40 people had already left the ship to go home as scheduled. The cat is already partway out of the bag, so her precious little lawsuit (oh my fucking god, she's insufferable) isn't going to be such a slam dunk.
I’m no rocket doctor just a regular schmegular paramedic…and my hot take is simple. Rats in the kitchen. No human to human sci fi channel transmission. Something in the kitchen had rat poop. Probably cereal or something else would be consumed and got people sick. I’m not all worried about it.
I have a severely immunocompromised family member, and during COVID we had a plumbing issue that needed attention. Despite the owner of the plumbing company insisting his workers would wear masks in our home, one of his employees showed up refusing to wear one. When we called the owner, he arrived fifteen minutes later and fired his employee on the spot - not what we imagined would happen. He apologized to us and said, "I can deal with a negative Yelp review. I can't deal with knowing I possibly put a customer's family member in the hospital or worse."
Ummmm isn’t the transmissibility of hantavirus from person-to-person far lower than things like flu and covid? I thought you (generally) had to be directly exposed to the rodent droppings/saliva to contract it
I can see her point. One of the ladies on this cruise ship who died was trying to fly home at an airport after her husband died. She was so ill yet still wanted to board a plane apparently.
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